Archive for February, 2010

informal talk of Jesus seeker illusions and Christian Anti-Christ

February 28, 2010

Gary says to sawyer:

I do agree you have offered me great insight to what the class and TI and DO taught, and that is something I never thought would have happened, though I never knew anything about TI until I made contact with you. As for the answer to your question as to what I love about TI and DO. I love them for who they were, kind, gentle people. I know love is more than a feeling, it is an action.Never having met them or the others, I can only go by what I have seen in the videos, and I do realize that is maybe not enough. I know Jesus loved those He never met, and I want to help people see that kind of love even for those I never knew. Something else too, when you told me I seemed to be praising you when we talked or in my emails, in my heart I am not praising you, I see it as encouraging you as I do with most people I care about.I no more want praise from others either, but I do welcome encouraging words. I do not tell one of our associates or my wife they are capeable of doing a task, or improving a situation to praise them, I do it for encouragement and to give them a boost of confidence. Kinda like a child, if the parents do not give them positive and encouraging words the child will not grow up with confidence and srive to do better at what it is he or she is capeable of, garbage in, garbage out concept.
I do not praise any man other than Christ. Humans are faliable, Christ was not. I try to treat people equaly, not indifferently, though I fail at it a lot of times, I continue to try. So let me know you thoughts on this. Peace to you always.

Sawyer Heavensgate:

Hi Gary – I know I’ve been directly critical of much of what you’ve said, both about Jesus, Ti and Do and others – that doesn’t come easy to me as my vehicles personality stives to be liked by everyone, but if I am to continue offerring what Ti and Do, through my experiences with them have offerred me then I must continue for whatever it’s worth, … that is when I hear and see things that strike me as potentially benefiting from correction, which actually is everything to include all that I think, say and do. By correction what I am meaning is simply improvment which always involves a type of course correction/change, not a self righteous Lording over that is so common among humans in every walk. Yes, I too have influences that can try to get me to fill myself with myself but when we have been taught to at least be open to such, and we continuously have a mindset of wanting to do better-receive correction from whatever instrument may deliver it, then it’s all “good”. It’s when we close ourselves off to course correction that we sink more and more into one or another form of entrenchment and stagnation (though we may still talk the talk of growth and change).

When you say Jesus was perfect, I know you don’t KNOW the real Jesus. Go see what he said about that. When you say you love Jesus, go see what he said the criteria was that would demonstrate “love”. Look at what he said about “prasing with mouth while heart is far from me”, a form of washing the outside of the cup “saying things that sound wonderful and positive while not willing to change because of how it upsets our apple cart. Repent meant “change you mind” literally. That means “think differently”. You are clinging to either the retorick you’ve been programmed to accept or are engaged in a game. Anybody can be “nice” and “kind”. Look at what Jesus said about that. “even the evil love their own and want good things for their own”, and yes one can still refrain from thinking we can “judge/measure” those that we see that participate in very predatory and harmful to life and life choice behaviors – why – because as jesus said, the “sun is also shining for them” in other words they too are part of the overall creation – gifted with life by no effort of their own (though it does take effort to survive and live), but none of the elements and systems and choices were provided by humans, except indirectly by use of all the elements. You said jesus loves even those he doesn’t know. Well for one which “love” word was he most likly using and what degree of love is he talking about. It’s easy to say that because everyone is programmed with that. If that wasn’t put out then one of the major aspects that draw people to religions would vanish. The prime way he does “love” all in his Father’s admiraling of the creation is by giving us all an equal chance to become all we want to become, whether that is. In other words, giving us a degree of free will is the extention of love and then giving of his efforts to help potentially all is yet another extenstion BUT if we refuse to accept that offerring by ignoring it or misusing it and ultimatelly steering others away from it (done in indirect ways that look the part) then, after so many opportunities to change his “love” becomes seeing to it that the waste (those that care nothing for anything but themselves and their own) and have no longer any sense of reality any more, thinking of themselves in one way or another as having “found” their truth and ceasing to look further and “change their minds” to the tune of influencing others to be like themselves, then he is showing his love for those that still have a chance by recycling those that have become weeds and then he’s not really showing love for the weeds is he? So this idea that he loves everything is balony and I can back that up with many scriptures.

If and when you become and/or continue to be a more ardent seeker of the highest truthes (which are not the mystical esoteric hokus pokus “spiritual” generalities and supernatural emphasized religiosities, things we’re told are those truthes, which I understand is a difficult process that we all must be engaged, and can be fooled by and thus must press through to get the kernals of reality), you will come back with the substansive details of what Jesus was about, rather than the christian hollywood styled anti-Jesus reality expressions. I have tried to share many of those with you, through the review I began to write for your book that you moreorless ignored as it would have been too much effort to postpone it’s publication, I suppose, to make improvements in the areas I suggested (as it understandably but tragically for your sake (if you continuously ignore what could very well be your greatest chance to learn about the real Jesus)). And I continue to share things with you and you say to me, thank you for the lesson (a term of endearment and a phony one I’m afraid to have to admit) because you don’t really think of me as teaching you anything or you would show more evidence of it, in “changing your mind”(which I absolutely do not WANT you to do to satisfy ME and absolutely do not care to be thought of as a teacher to you (though anyone at anytime can be a teacher to anyone at anytime IF someone is seeking to grow/change/evolve/develop in whatever area). Now, having said that for whatever it’s worth to you, perhaps I am wrong and perhaps you are changing your mind in ways I have yet to see (and of course you owe me nothing in that as I am not your god). But if you want to continue this level of relationship with me, I need to see that at least some of it you are taking to heart by at the very least challenging what I say about Jesus WITH examples of how I may be seeing it or seeing Jesus in a less than accurate light (since we do appear to have a common interest in Jesus, as opposed to the one sided aspect of my talking about Ti and Do whom you have little experience with, understandably). And if you can’t debate me, then research the subject for yourself – look up the greek and hebrew and latin and cultural context as best we can. And most of all. Talk to God the creator about it. Ask to be shown the highest interpretations and go over it over and over and over as time and effort permits and do so with a willingness to “change your mind”. I try to do the same things. It’s ongoing. However, if this means next to nothing to you, then you will simply assume you already have the highest way of looking at it, because of what this or that author or preacher told you – “like that satan is  the instigator of the idea that the Jesus second coming would be in secret”,when I’ve pointed out the numerous things Jesus said that counteract that idea, at least for the phase Jesus was speaking of where he would be “revealing more of what previously were mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven” and would “speak plainly of the kingdom” and that both he and his Father would take up dwelling/residence with us, and that he would come as a “thief in the night” (certainly quite hidden) and could go on and on. I don’t fault you for not knowing how to come back with debate on these and other things but I do fault “holding onto the same old thinking when you’ve received opportunity to change” and that doesn’t mean you must parrott ME as if I am seeking to grow in understanding I am still open to further changes and adjustments which you could easly be stimulated by your questions and comments though doesn’t imply that all understandings will change. I don’t know if this means much to you but I think it could. I know change is tough but the true God team requires it constantly to strive to be on their team – that I am sure of.

Influences 101 – discarnate, evil or angelic spirits and the ultimate purpose for human – to become a member of the Physical Level Above Human aka the Kingdom of God

February 28, 2010

Influences 101 – discarnate, evil or angelic spirits and the ultimate purpose for human – to become a member of the Physical Level Above Human aka the Kingdom of God

What do we mean by “influences”. In this context they can be virtually anything that causes us to gravitate to behaviors that in the end steer us away from a potential graduation experience into the One True Physical Level Above Human, aka the Kingdom of God/Heaven/Nirvana/Enlightenment. Therefore to each of us, who are engaged or not in a varied stage of that ultimate opportunity obtainment, they can be different things to different people both seen as helpful and/or hurtful in the human condition of life experiences. It is very simple yet very complicated to explain and understand in it’s full breadth because influences are not really “good or bad”.

All things on Earth are opportunities and all things on Earth can be used and abused. There are ramifications to all things we do and degrees of those ramifications and especially as they affect others to “influence” their thoughts, words and deeds. It was said that the Earth is God’s footstool and it is so, but The Kingdom of God doesn’t need a footstool personally, except to enable or facilitate humans to have the step by step choice to eventually “stand up” to a graduation/harvest/bearing of fruit (exist-become an adult(from the perspective of the Kingdom of God).

Now, these “influences” take on several forms but largely are actually real in the context of having a degree of personna, like a software module has it’s own unigue signature memory(data) and function relative to what they are the result of, in this case the result of the experience of living beings (human, animal and plant). These in times past were thought of as “dead” people, discarnates – spirits, souls(though there is a differentiation), evil or good, demonic or angels(depending on one’s perspective, as a demon is that which ultimately influences you away from seeking a better real active relationship with the Kingdom of God vs and Angel who assists us to have that relationship. The demons try to persuade us and even manipulate us to serve their self based desires while the angels only respond to our asking for help, though at the last trimester when all human characteristics must be “overcome”(outgrown) discarded, the process of giving our entire will over to a physically present “shepard” (someone from the Kingdom of God sent to midwife us through the spirit-birth canal), even discarnate beings that previously could be seen as helpful are yet another negative influnece to the completion of our overall task as the only help we must seek, in order to establish and maintain a viable graft to the branch of the Next Level’s tree, as represented by that physically present (incarnate) soul from the Next Level, is from that member regardless of what they provide us to think, say or do, that will entail “giving one’s life” to the Kingdom of God through that incarnate member – as Jesus said he was “the way, the truth and the light” and how “no one comes to the Father except through me”, person(sheperd(sheep herder)).

Thus an “influence” can be a voice in our head, a thought, a feeling, a desire, a strategy to get what we think (or that influence) wants, a lure or temptation to do that which we’ve been taught and have accepted to some degree as being bad or wrong or sinful, (that is or isn’t based on the fact that, it’s not so much what a human gets into that’s most important to their overall growth as the Next Level sees growth, it’s what they get out of that’s most important. For instance becoming an alchoholic is not morally bad in the eyes of the Next Level, but not striving to learn from the ramifications of such a type of addiction is not becoming an adult and therefore a stumbling block(sin=missed the mark/goal we set out to make) to our full potential. Now when humans impose their own ideas of what is or isn’t sin, that’s where the idea of sin becomes something to rebel from. The laws given by the Kingdom of God do make their way into society- “you should not kill” for instance, though by many to be obvious at this time, (yet still justified by many or thought of only as premeditated murder, that many seperate into being defensive which takes on the judgement of “eye for an eye”, though becomes in realtyy eye for an entire body justifying even attacks against others “in case they might want to or be able to attack us sometime in the perceived near or distant future, whereby attack can take on the definition of that which interfers with whatever the other parties agenda is that they feel is being threatened.

Now to “influences” as we have defined them:

Yes we are tricked and manipulated by influences BUT we allow it. It’s simply part of growing up – learning inch by inch to identify them and do so sooner and sooner and then bypassing and/or ignoring their rant or urge (that pushes our buttons, resulting in almost an impossible chore of stopping the “tapes” from playing in our heads – past things, ego or inadaquacies, guilts, errors and successes(that entrench us, keep us from continuous seeking and the changes of mind(repent) that goes with success, so not to lose that success) – to no end, all challenging tendencies that are part of the free will environment that enables us to gradually build up our mind muscle, though mostly when the Next Level(aka kingdom of God) sends their physically incarnate member(s) to midwife us through our next trimester in our overall potential birth plan).

You and WE(whoever that applys to) are all learning(in varying degrees) to ride the horse(what our human bodies/vehicles are) ALONE. Our Older Members (Ti(Father/Lord/Yahweh/Jehovah, etc.) and Do(Jesus/Elijah/Moses/Enoch,Buddha, etc.) do not want to ride our horse. They want to teach us how, though while teaching us, which is a small percentage informational and a larger percentage showing us by their physical presence in behavior and ways, riding the horse they have chosen, to which we in our experiences can try to increasingly apply. While human it’s safe to say we will never be free of influences and never have an easy time of keeping their arguments at bay. We will succeed in some areas and for some periods of time until they catch us off guard in another or after we build our confidence in keeping them out. (By the way that confidence is really a false confidence, because our Older Member on occasion steps in to take away some of our bombardment if they feel it’s too much and allows bigger boogers(advasaries/satans) to become our boxing sparring partner – there simply to help us build up our application of the techniques given to us by those Older members that build our faith when we catch on to how it works and where to go for help with each bout (Our Older Members whether physically present or not).

Some of “our” influences help us function in the world, like say we have a particular job we’ve learned to do or skill or talent we like to express. We could think then that we could take this overcoming process to an extreme and do nothing – climb into a cave or join a cloistered monastic group or become a hermit in the woods, which would actually defeat the purpose of the influences presence “for us” to allow us to discern who are the destructive ones to our future Life in the Next Level and who will be easy to fluff off when the time comes.

Like someone might love playing golf and get very good at it and even make money from it. Along the way they attract influences big and small that when living also loved golf, thus gravitated to someone living who could manifest that satisfaction for them, as they no longer have an instrument that was sensory and experiential. (For the influneces it’s strictly programatic/robotic). Now, first off, golf is not harmful to others, physcially or mentally or in terms of advancement of the soul towards next level membership. However, if one makes it their ALL, then it could become a big booger for them to overcome what they derive from it but if it’s not one’s ALL and they could moreorless take it or leave it and it would not send them into deep depresssion then when that person is in a classroom with a member of the Next Level physically among them and the Older Member says, “we’re here” – time to go if you want – need to give your all – you have to leave your world and ways behind – be raptured(capturing the horse your trying to use then), if you then thought, “oh, I need to first win that golf tornament”, THEN even golf for that person becomes EVIL (to that would be total overcomer) as IT is manipulating that person to stay rooted to the human kingdom and it’s ways and successes (and even failures, as all things can be addictive).

But if some activity never became a big success story for that person, they would just say…no big deal – I don’t care if I play golf again. Now they may then enter the classroom(the experiential living with and working for an physically present member from the Next Level) and still have golfing influences to contend with now and again and they will have to learn to shoo them away like mosquitos until they either stop knocking on their mental door/opening or they give up on us in that way, depending on how big a hold they once had on us as there are always other golfers to find to influence.

Now I am not pretending to say that giving into all influences is condoned because eventually you can deal with them. What we do now does, I believe go towards our future and what will come more easily when we do join a classroom, presumably after the recycling reshapes the planet’s surface for a fresh start. And of course some influences are more serious than others, and espeically when they get between our working with others and/or affecting others – influencing others to act in certain ways whether they seek to overcome or not. Like Do said in the classroom, you try to fight the sensual influences from having their way with us, as it is a basic requirement to discard all our sexuality, but if despite our best growing attempts we have a nocternal emmission that we did nothing conscious to stimulate, then it’s not to feel guilt about – it’s a relief valve – it’s energy off the top, but to take that as a reason to become a sex addict whether in mind or in body is simply getting more and more addicted making it harder and harder to climb out of that addiction. The same would apply to a power addict, someone who runs things – controls others, manages others, becomes a teacher to others. They are building their ego and have all sorts of influences that gravitate to such folks to help them be very good at it. When we take advantage of the influences we attract then we are also becoming a horse rider of our own horse although influences aided us in our human activity progression, though if they left, we would loose steam in that department and even cease to function as well as we used to, to return to a condition of dependance upon others for everything.

So to get back to the original example of  golf, I can’t imagine Do at this time would find fault with someone playing golf or for that matter participating in such equivilent activities for fun and/or relaxation and of course that is meant for those that wish to begin their “overcoming process” (which many are engaged in without necessarily considering it an overcoming process, but because they have learned and believe such and such activity physical and/or mental is detrimental for their physical/mental health and well being. What these don’t always know is the prime reason they have learned what is better or worse for the physical/mental health of the human vehicle is because at some point by the periodic physical presense of Next Level Older Members in our overall environment, whether they have become incarnate or not, Their awareness of reality which entails ways of progressing and doing better in every tiny way IS made available and more accessible and in a plainer and clearer fashion, as the human vehicles build their own databases(minds) to recognize and apply more.

I received this understanding initially from my 19 years an experiential student of Ti and Do (1975-1994), that expanded when I began to reconnect to being in their service in 1997 (to 2010+) following their volutary group laying down of their physical vehicles to then take up a new station of LIFE, one that is incorruptible and everlasting as promised that by doing in the worldwide way in which they did, left a strong mark on the human beings who come to the information.

Q & A re G’s statements about obama & God & civil war in America & Sawyer’s responses

February 23, 2010

G posts this:


Sawyer Heavensgate:

G, I’m embarrassed that you can talk so immaturly while wearing the banner of “heaven’s gate” in your icon as people will connect the two. You have a right to your opinion of course but I am going to respond in kind. Ti and Do were never hate mongers and you sound like a fox news propogandist that says nothing but uses lots of inflamitory verbage. Who are you trying to provoke? I frankly don’t think obama or anyone else will ever turn this beast of a corporate/militaristic controlled nation around as too many are in bed with it to the enth degree.


I have to admit you are correct about my statement. I can be pretty radical at times, guess it comes from my hippie protesting blood. I will be blunt, honest, and truthfully straight forward. I have studied history, the church and governments linked to Bible prophecy and beyond the shadow of a doubt the United States and the Roman Catholic Church are two of the beast powers in Revelation. Even the reformers saw this and knew it. I do not claim to be a prophit or predict the future, but call it a gut instinct. America is headed for a civil war on its own soil, unlike anything these last three generations have ever seen, and I believe it will begin around 2012 with the assination of Obama.The Myans calander foretold the end of the world, but mankind has always got it wrong, however it could be the end of a civilized world which I believe to be the U.S. and its way of life as we know it. After this civil war I also look for a church and state government to rise up out of the ashes to form its new government. Please do not get me wrong, I am in no way making any threats or planning any harm to anyone. I just know what the American Beast power is capable of. Like it or not we will have to fight. Even the Christians are unprepared for what I feel is coming. I love people, TI, Do and Heaven’s Gate, but I cannot stand by and let this now Federal Reserve banking cartel government just walk over us, if we as the people lay down and take it, our nation will become a full power marxist nation. I do not wish to fight in any war and would protest any draft instituted to infiltrate a war overseas, but when it comes to our own backyard, it will be, kill or be killed. I do have faith that God will keep people safe through these turbulant times. If I do not write and stand on the rock of my belief I just as soon stand on the sand which has no foundation.
I am not trying to disrespect anyone, I am just being truthful and honest with my feelings and if that entails offending people then I guess it will be that way. I do not follow the traditions of man, concidering that is what gets us into difficult situations in the first place and always has throughout history. I hope you understand and can see where I am coming from. So let me know what your take on this lesson is. I always love to hear your thoughts Sawyer and welcome your insight. Peace  

Sawyer Heavensgate February 22 at 8:14pm:

Sorry G, I don’t buy it. you gave me some clues just now as to why but in case some of what you said is actually the way you feel and believe, you are creating that civil war and that’s not a way of the next level – it’s luciferian more than any president. Obama was taken over not mystically. He was told in no uncertain terms that if he stepped into areas that caused interference he and perhaps his family are history. The current beast, that I do agree the US but really extends to the corporate gods that includes all the spiritual so called heirarchys as they are all creatures that prey on others in one way or another while often using loving words and acts of kindness to help persuade others to their allegiences are everywhere throughout ever facet of society – make up the society and they all thrive on blood, blood money, blood for resources and blood to maintain dominance.

The next level is in full control, the reason the class had to get out of the way to let happen what is happening which will escalate and will never be stopped except by the hand of what we think of as nature – natural and man made disasters along with rouge increased militias and further justification to clamp down on the population of the US with more police and harrassment and sting operations and manipulations to get what they want. You are being put to the test right now. You can show your allegience and die to what you are in allegience to: There are only two choices: God/Kingdom of and in Heaven or Human/Kingdom of Mammalian.

How do we SHOW allegience? Only one way and it’s not talk – it’s action. What you act upon you align with. “Let the just continue to be just and the unjust continue to be unjust”. We become what we align with. Thus those who “live by the sword die by the sword” common sense, the others live and die by another way and that shows the next level who has their seed and who really is a spawn of satan’s seed. Evil one=troublemaker, Satan=An advasary. If you are advasarial against humans you are a trouble maker.

However should I be in my house when someone was coming in and would probably not care about harming whoever is around that they deam an enemy I feel my natural instinct would be to protect my loved ones but first by trying to be keen to becoming a refugee first. God isn’t attached to any one piece of land and niether should we be that is if we want to form allegience to the One real True creator kingdom above human called Gods.

But your talk is not radical – it’s geared to be inflamitory to freighten the very people you are claiming to “love”. I suspect you are gaming in ways you know and in ways you know not so you WILL reap what you sow -that’s the way it always is for all of us.  

G on February 22 at 9:39pm:

Hey Sawyer, I love these discussions we have, and I would not trade them for all the gold pressed latinum in the universe. (A little Star Trek humor there). I have to agree with a lot of what you say here as well. Like I said before, I do not know that a civil war will break out in America, I just know that people have forgotten and do not study history, therefore they are subject to repeat it. I do not want this to happen, but I have no control over the powers that be. I know within my heart that this land and this planet is not my perminate residence, the Kingdom of God/ Next Level is where I will reside after this worn out ole planet is recycled and it is referbished to its original state. Its funny, when you explain it in such a simple way, I do not feel so rebelious and agitated and I see situations differently. Please do not worry, I am not puting you up as a leader to follow, but I like your perspective on things. I try not to sound like fox news propaganda people for I know they are in bed with their own enemies and it is sad. Thank you for helping me get my brain cells straight. I look forward to our next lesson. Peace to you Sawyer.
P.S. I will remove that obama thing fro my profile page.


Civil war IS in process as we speak. Someone flying a plane into a IRS building as you cheered IS evil executed against evil. People will annialiate one another in the streets more and more and in the schools as the karma like a rolling stone gathers moss in it’s auto return – hatred out = hatred in.

And you nor I can NEVER EVER EVER assume or be confident or know that we are worth ANYTHING to the next level Kingdom of God/Jesus, etc. and If we are worth something, what that might amount to – some genetic seed to save for a furture planting to use as fertilizer or a soul cocooning. At best when we die the Next Level might save our essence but only if our essence has a potential future and it only has a potential future if we at this time show willingness to provide Them with service. Their promises past through moses and jesus only extend to the availablity of opportunity for all those that continuously seek, knock, ask, change their minds and “do as they do” as demonstrated by all previous members of the Next Level. Of course, they don’t expect more than they know we are capable, so we really can’t judge ourselves unworthy exactly either.

So what is servicable to the Next Level. Well, when the Older members are not physically present (as they are not, whether we believe ti and do are they or not), there is no one I have seen that demonstrates ALL the behaviours and heightened challenging life choices (except in my opinion as demonstrated by Ti and Do, as bizarre as they are to virtually all of us (in degrees, as my vehicle still has discarnate influences that squirm when they see/hear Do talking, which was the case early on in my classroom experience with them but then when I had degrees of success getting rid of certain discarnates or at least keeping them at bay (not letting their thoughts exist or even register in my head) I did not experience that discomfort, though another set of discarnates stepped in to challenge me to instead develop an ego of feeling like I knew Do and had some confidence as to what degree, which is not necessarily inaccurate BUT and it’s a big BUT it’s real easy to become over-confident, which I did experience and evidenced the folly of, which is the reason I am here now – because the classroom was not providing me with the lessons I needed OR I failed to ASK them to help me with those lessons, instead relying on myself to learn them my way. That self reliance is great in the early grades of the human kingdom as it helps provide all sorts of things that then can be the aids to the growth of our mind/spirit/soul to “give over” when the Older Member is physically with us to help us down the birth canal, which for all who are not part of WILL look as bizarre as Jesus looked to most and as Ti and Do looked to most.

Thus the service I speak of is only manifest in one way. Trying to speak to the highest beings we can imagine that are not in any way shape or form human (though appear human to the causual uninformed unprepared human when they are physically here) promoters of normal human behaviours to ASK to be of service which will always entail a step by step process of ask and watch, ask again and see what we experience around us and then ask again and consider some action – whether talking about the Next Level and/or changing our behaviours and then asking/watching again as if we were seeking to hone in on an interfacing signal.

However, asking is not void of interference. Who we think we are asking is crutial. jesus proved that using the word “jesus” would become moot. That’s why he said “many will come in my name, saying I am the annointed one, don’t believe them”. That’s why they always come with new names as handles. (pretty soon the names Ti and Do will become overly corrupted, but they work for now, shoud someone be brave enough to give them a try, if only as an experiment. No telling what someone may experience).

And to the idea that Jesus would not return in secret (as a thief in the night) (as if/when he doesn’t come in secret it’s then too late to change), which I believe to be a Luciferian Space Alien disinformation, Jesus said when he came back he would “speak plainly of the kingdom no longer in parables and he would tell us more of the reality about the Kingdom of Heaven and he and his father would make our dwelling place/residence (stay) with us. Sure we can say that’s all representative of his being with us in spirit form or in idea alone, but aren’t those and other things very strong indicators of a face to face relationship? How else is he going to talk to us and explain more to us except he is physically eye to eye with us? What is more bizarre to believe – that this is all meant as a spiritual etheric manifestation or as a real physical manifestation or actually both as it is both. Both the physical (flesh) and spirit/mind/soul He represents to us upon his return.

But again, a return is rarely if ever an event in characteristic with a human government or nation. I say that with Moses in mind as it was said he was raised in royalty (though not really of their seed).

So yes, the entire money system is certainly not a Next Level instrument, thus it’s related to humanness and even a glueing of it’s supporters to the human activitives it facilitates so yes that translates to the product of those who hate the next level so you are correct in seeing that system as one face of that revelations beast.

14 characteristics that any representative (christ/maitreya) from the Kingdom of(in) Heaven/God will teach

February 23, 2010
Characteristics of the Garden Nurturing Task that any members from the Evolutionary Level Above Human, formally known in the records as the Kingdom of God or Kingdom of Heaven will emulate/teach by Their example that sets Them apart from the many Human Evolutionary Level – Kingdom known as false prophets, charlatans, wolves in sheeps clothing, facsimili’s.
(I say members plural as in history we have accounts of more than one member interfacing with humans at any one time, be they of a primary or secondary task role, and whether their interface is through their taking over a human vehicle, thus to be seen or to remain largely behind the scenes and unseen.)
1. They say they are from Outer space (heaven), and NOT another planet in another star system.
The Next Level has no need for one home planet. They don’t live the way humans do in family units with young running around that need constant monitoring. All members of the Next Level are adults in that respect and all proved their worthiness to become a member thus have tasks pertinent to their desire and station of serviciablity. Each member had their “spirit” birth from a Earth like planet, thus they may always consider that home in that sense, yet it will become as distant a memory as an actual birth location does for humans. Members of the Next Level are not nostalgic in that way. They don’t live in the past or the future. They are always living for the NOW. This enables each member to give their best effort to whatever task they hold. It’s not that they don’t obtain memories, but the memories associated with the upbringing of the last physical body they inhabited, that they overcame the tendencies and desires of as part of their metamorphic process of consciously evolving out of the human kingdom and it’s limitations, that is enough to graduate, is rendered part of their subconscious mind, that is until such memories are no longer of service. It is for this reason a member from the Next Level, who has taken on the task from their Older Member, according to their asking for their next task needs to literally take over an existing member of the human kingdom in which they are about to be the teacher for, to best help those humans, the physical genetic strain and the mental genetic strain seeded with a soul pocket/container and a basic installment of Next Level “holy” mind(spirit) – the information needed to interface with the Next Level and to conquer their human limitations.
2. Consistant with all previous members from the Kingdom of God – though with updates. As humans can see more of the reality of God’s kingdom, God shares more of that reality with each new representative, but that new representative does not negate any of the principals. Instead the new representative simply narrows the scope of the application of the same principas. The principals are designed to help wean us from our more animalistic tendencies and instincts. These are primarily identified by being self orientated, however families tend to cause us to extend our selfness nature to the support of others, even ahead of ourselves, thus teaching us to be more like members of the Level Above Human who operate from a service model.  Now service is not a result of being lorded over. It’s the type of service that one is proud to be a spoke in the wheel because they clearly recognize the vast magnificence of what we until then larglyt take for granted as the “creation” we term our reality. Humans who begin to seperate from their more animalistic selfishness are extending their consciousness outside of themselves which if continued can only lead to more awareness of that which is outside their own bubble, so they begin to see more of what is already present that many others haven’t grown to see/understand. It’s not the type of seeing/understanding that comes from reading books. It only comes by experience seeking and in so doing, receiving and then feeling more momentum to seek further, so much so that one may eventually be selected by the Next Level to attend a graduation classroom that will teach them how to make the final transition out of the human kingdom and into the next kingdom above human.
3. When they come they always bring a new terminology. The terms they use must reflect the fact that the last time they came they seeded some humans with souls and fed those souls some of their NL (holy) mind(spirit). This enabled each new student to a greater capasity of understanding and that leads to not needing certain proofs that others who had not received that soul implant or rejected it, will not get and will even think lunacy.  All the first trimester souls will not related at all to the new terminology. And they are not supposed to as they are being given the opportunity to advance to their next station – their second trimester. The second trimester souls will begin to understand the new terminology because they were already familiar with it from their first trimester. These will be the ones that will begin to believe in the latest representatives who came to primarily work with the third trimester souls to bring them to graduation. The second trimester souls have the challenge of coming to terms with that reps arrival and departure and if they remain viable, in other words had not become too entrenched in their human successes to where they kept an open eye to what transpired when the third trimester trumphets were blown and the graduation class has made themselves known to the world, to where they were drawn to know more, however hard that is because each step always presents a challenge. That challenge is the nature of growth. If they rise to the occasion of fully embracing the recognition of the latest representative and begin their conscious relationship with those current reps, by asking to be of service, which will primarily constitute acting on faith to a large degree in sharing the information those reps bore with others no matter the ramifications as the only ones that will respond favorably are others in either the first, second or third trimster (as not all in the third trimester are born/graduated). All the rest of the humans on the planet were either not planted with a Next Level interface or subdued the interface they once had to a point that they either can not see the Next Level’s reality in any shape or form and/or refuse to keep an eye open to it. These will be advasarial to all those in any trimester of development and it could result in the loss of life for those who are putting forth the information they then deem blastphemy, heritical, insane, a genetic disorder and therefore inferior to them and in some cased disposible to keep such a condition from spreading. However, no soul in service to the Next Level to whatever degree in first, second or third trimester will be lost simply by the loss of their physical body. The body is eventually expendable anyway. It’s a temporary container, like a cocoon that is used for a souls’s metamorposis towards their “spirit birth” as Jesus called it a birth of a new mind (new wine) within the new wineskin (soul container). The Next Level knows where all their still viable soul seeds are and see to it that they are met when they drop their physical container and thereby “saved”, a type of being put on ice, so to speak, which is not the ultimate graduation, though in so doing – being willing to go the distance despite the threat to their physical vehicles well being, becomes another star in their crown that deepens their interface and thereby improves their faith as they retain the memory of their actions when the Next Level brings them back for their attempted third trimester.  They then assume when they hear the trumphet call, the Older Member from the Next Level again in human form, announcing their arrival and the same qualifications for membership to include a willingness to “give” or even lay down one’s life to show the Next Level they are not bound by the vehicle (while all others are agast at the idea), which in part then becomes the challenge to once again overcome by detaching the vehicle they are taking over to complete their third trimester through from it’s genetic attachments).
4. They come to us physically – mouth to mouth (leaving less doubt) and receive communication directly from their Older Members who don’t speak in riddles (dark speech). They speak “plainly of the kingdom” but to those not of their immedieate fold talk in story form parables as they are not yet prepared to understand the directness.
5. They operate in partnerships. If a member rep is alone they have student partnerships (aaron and miriam who become spokespersons and receive communication in dreams/visions, Jesus with John, Peter and James on the transfiguration mount.
6. They pull from all history of NL working with humans thus krishna, buddist, jew, christian, islam, etc. (Ti and Do were called a hodge podge).
7. They bring updates but of the same veins. See Adultery and how jesus handled it without stoning.
8. They don’t have families – even speak against their human family as being their real family. No children are allowed to be with them, except in Moses first trimester as they were not cutting their roots then, which a child can’t do until it has decided by free will to do so.
9. The instill the idea of the sacrifice of the physical reality – “cut off hand”, “pluck out eye”, don’t save your life, turn the other cheek (yet don’t test oneself, avoid confrontation), castrate self – all an exception for one’s desire to become a member in the Kingdom of God.
10. It a gift to receive communication and is earned. Not an easy road, but easyier in terms of human survival as putting trust in god’s hands rather than being worried about food and shelter. Knowing that if we do god’s will first all these things shall be added to you.
11. Follow the laws – pay taxes so not to be interfered with.
12. don’t put on garb of holiness or have soft speach to sound holy or have an air of holiness or enlightenment.
13. They give credit to their older member. They seek to be their older members tool.
14. They promote self discipline, restraint of thoughts and actions, not clinging to negative habits and addictions. They encourage change, change of mind (open mindedness), willingness to learn and be mistaken about things, cleanliness of the inside and outside of the “cup” and our environment, caring for all life forms, but not to an extreme of not using the resources and opportunities before us. They present upgrades to laws and guidelines that are consistant though challenging to live up to – “love your enemies”, “if it keeps you from advancing to the Next Level it’s not out of the question to even take what would be generally seem like drastic measures, though not to be imposed on others even to include the jesus examples of “pluck out an eye or cut off a hand or make oneself a eunuch and the sacrifice of comforts and self “will”, giving to those who ask of us, not worry about the future but trusting in the real Older Members from the Next Level sent to assist us in our schooling towards an eventual graduation experience (harvest, receiving a “celestial flesh” and moreorless a potential “eternal” life (not simply a still temporary spirit existence as that is NOT life. They teach flexabilty and tolerence and patience and kindness and compassion towards all life forms but especially to one another (love neighbor AS yourself). They teach striving for excellence in all we do, though there are extremes that become dis-functional and should not include that which alters another’s opportunity to live and experience a choicefull life.
They teach non-aggression but keeness to avoid conflict but not simply to preserve one’s life longer or one’s satisfactions from life. Satisfaction is stagnation but the dissatisfaction would be a characteristic of a Next Level member in their quest for knowledge and greater function/service to their Older Member (captain) who is in service to their Captain and so on, and the happiness that comes from doing so where one can see how other beings can benefit in potential “everlasting” ways.
They are not judgemental or crude in their thoughts or actions. They are gentle and meek in their actions though always seek to be more efficient and timely with no wasted motion though also recognize while in the human environment a need/benefit to relaxation and entertainment and fun, though would never have fun that extends hurtfullness towards others.
They are direct though when it comes to pointing out where the illusions exist in the human kingdom yet don’t do so as humans do with animosity and vengefullness and competitions. They are not hypocritical. They don’t expect less of themselves than they do of their students. They lead the way in every department. They are never without experience in the human kingdom as part of their task is to become human to a degree and then to get out of what binds them to their humanness so they can demonstrate and teach how others can do that.
They recognize that true independence is really non-existant in the human kingdom (which extends to human equivilent space aliens) except as an illusion in someone’s head. They recognize the great value and even the very lifeline to eternal growth and opportunity and LIfe by knowing that the only way that can be acheived is through becoming totally dependant on their Older Members (by Older I am speaking in terms of experience and membership in that Above Human condition Next Level, aka Kingdom of God/Heaven/Nirvana, etc.).
However, the Older Member seeing a younger members desire to not be independant minded – “thy will be done on Earth as it is in heaven” and “deny yourself” – “do as I do” – “I have done all my Father has instructed me to do”, “I have kept all those  whom my Father has given me to shepard” (quotes all paraphrased, but nonetheless accurate to the intention and meaning), gives younger members, according to their real asking and expressed desires tasks that require a great deal of discernment and creativity and asking of help in a step wise pattern to accomplish as best they can be done by the Older Member’s higher standards (that humans often misplace onto the lessor concerns – “swing at a gnat and swallow a camel”.
to be continued…
There are many, many more characteristics of Next level members. Sure they look bizarre to humans who have become complacent and ordinary and simply pleasure seeking sponges (though working hard to have what they want) and unknowingly manipulated (thinking they have freedoms because of having slightly more freedoms than others in their very brief recorded history).

Jesus sees most christian spiritual teachers as antichrists led by the luciferian ufo space aliens

February 16, 2010

Jesus sees most christian spiritual teachers as antichrists led by the luciferian ufo space aliens

This is the theme of my upcoming blogtalkradio show scheduled to air live on Wednesday, Feb. 17, 2010 at 10pm ET, that can be heard by logging into and/or calling the show at: 347-205-9777 and can join into the conversation and/or chat with me about. And if you want to hear it after the broadcast it can be listened to and/or downloaded for free as a .mp3 podcast at:

To follow is the show description broadened some for the blog post:

This is not an accusation against those who believe in ALL that Jesus taught as best they can understand and who have congregations looking to them for spiritual guidence UNLESS they also try to sheild their congregations from the exploration of all things so called spiritual or otherworldly or paranormal. It was Paul who condemned people that considered the study of the stars appealing and Paul was NOT a Jesus disciple. A disciple had to be able to physically “follow him” night and day wherever he went which was impossible after he left by way of a cloud of light.

So Paul was at best a new believer. A new believer’s ONLY task is to tell others about the representative from the Kingdom of Heaven, so the best Paul could do would have been to find out what Jesus told His disciples and share EXACTLY those things. Instead he built his own “body of believers”(church) evidenced by his letters and telling them to look to him. Sure he used the name Jesus but that was because he was captured by a Luciferian Space Alien who told him that’s who he was, something Jesus would never had done. Had it been that easy to convert people why would Jesus waste his time and effort living “face to face” with those His Father gave to him to teach.

This example of Paul was the first major co-opting of the Jesus mission stage. And we will see this now of course pertaining to the return of Jesus in the new names of Ti and Do as the Heaven’s Gate that was the next phase in the overall Level Above Human creator kingdoms garden harvest of souls project. Thus there are NO new disciples of Ti and Do thus no new Heaven’s Gate group is legitimate in any form at any time. Only those who had a personal physical relationship with Ti and/or Do and are active students to date are authorized to represent them to others. New believers should limit what they say about Ti and Do to what Ti and Do published and in the many tapes they left behind. Anything more is subject to Luciferian space alien distortions.

This is the way religions form, which is why they become so, so easy to follow, because they are a co-opting that give the appearance of discipleship and thus assumes the pay off but without hardly any of the hard work required of a disciple called the “overcoming” process or the “path to enlightenment”, the Bodhi Satva in the east as Jesus said he has more than one flock he was tending, though he said in the last day (1000 years) the flocks would merge into one area for the next return which took place publically in the United statesm, though with expressions globally from 1973 to 1997 when the advanced students left via laying down their physical lives for their own final step in a long long graduation experience to prepare them to do so fully voluntarily and consciously, having had many, many opportunities to leave that endeavour.

This group was NOTHING like the Jim Jones group or the Branch Davidians or the Solar Temple people or any of the religious groups or cults. They only thing they had in common was talk about Jesus or some other former teacher and the fact that they died, which is actually common to most all of us in a cult or not. We all die and we all at some point talk about those we think are greater than us whether it’s in the science community or academics or in terms of religions and spiruality.

So yes in a world that mostly hates the idea that there is a creator kingdom of many physical individuals who participate in the many tasks associated with the design, development and maintence of the Next Level’s garden systems, those on Earth aspiring to be connected will always be seen as a cult by the virtually everyone.

But just because there are humans that justify killing, murdering other humans doesn’t mean that all humans are of that mindset and behavior.

So I say forget about religions and all they teach. Sure look at what the historic record says Jesus said and seek to understand that, which is hard, not because the record has been tampered with as it’s actually quite in tact but the tampering happened somewhat naturally in retranslations and lack of understandings in the first place to where translators often picked a word in english that ended up misrepresenting or keeping that word’s real meaning hidden.

The reason the Jesus record is in tact is because the Level Above Human (kingdom of God/heaven) saw to it that it remained in tact.

But all the organizations that are the religions have had their value to the Next Level to spread Jesus’ words and deeds but at the same time they are the #1 Killers of souls that might actually be ready to believe in the next step when it comes, which it already has in The Two Witnesses testimony (Ti and Do) throughout revelations but primarily in chapters 11 and 12. The women in Chapter 12 was Ti, who took a female human body to use for the mission and her child is Do in that dream depiction.

This is the same Father Son relationship that Jesus spoke so much about, both having returned as even Jesus insinuated in John:

Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come to him, and make our abode with him.

Yes this scripture is not taught as being literal but why. He wasn’t telling a story, a parable or making a comparison that could easily be seen as metaphorical, thus it’s a great example of how the co-opting takes place. Here is the bible software I used to get this scripture and it also provided it’s greek word dictionary for words used:

Bible Program Defintion:
Abode=3438 mone {mon-ay’}
 from 3306; TDNT – 4:579,581; n f
 AV – mansion 1, abode 1; 2
 1) a staying, abiding, dwelling, abode 2) to make an (one’s) abode 3) metaphorically: of the God the Holy Spirit indwelling believers
Note: more on this 3rd defintion later…a clear co-opting. Not saying it doesn’t hold some truth but it’s not directly related to what’s being spoken here and in accordance with the one other time mone is used to refer to “dwelling PLACES” and not to remain or mansions.
The first and second definitions can also be seen from the biggest authority in english to greek and/or hebrew, Strongs Concondance as follows:

Strongs Concordance: abode=
3438 monh mone mon-ay’
  a staying(place to stay), i.e. residence (the act or the place):–abode, mansion.
(thought to stem from 3306 menw meno men’-o
 a primary verb; to stay (in a given place, state, relation or expectancy):–abide, continue, dwell, endure, be present, remain, stand, tarry (for), X thine own.)

Notice how one of the strongs defintions is Mansion and how the only other time this specific word mone was used was in:

Joh 14:2 In my Father’s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Here he is also associating the greek word mone as a “mansion” but more literally a residence, a place to stay, a dwelling within the greater “house”:

Where did this idea of mansion come from? Well, I don’t know but what I do know is that it’s use doesn’t shed more light as to whether Jesus was speaking literal or figurative here but I do fault the translators for exaggerating as the use of “mansion” would suggest when there is no indication that it was anything more than a place or family or service to dwell, work with and/or be perform for.

Bible Program: house=
 3614 oikia {oy-kee’-ah}
 from 3624; TDNT – 5:131,674; n f
 AV – house 92, at home 1, household 1, from the house 1; 95
 1) a house 1a) an inhabited edifice, a dwelling 1b) the inmates of a house, the family 1c) property, wealth, goods

Now how could one have a mansion inside a house? That makes no sense to humans. But if you take the term and translate it as inhabited edifice or dwelling place and/or family/property a more likley scenerio appears that he was saying; “within the overall dwelling place(s) or family properties there are many grand locations – other places to reside and that your having a place is not something mystical or automatic – a specific place or postition needs to be prepared for. So translating this to mansions is misleading. Why did they limit it to one word when they had no idea what he might be actually saying. They should have included all the possabilities but then they had a discarnate or more in their ears trying to get them to misrepresent, while the Next Level saw to it that the core was still there anyway, because then anyone reading this can choose to accept what they are told or can try to find out for themselves what it meant, providing a choice that requires effort to pursue.

Now don’t forget, any would be translator does not act alone. They could feel differently but if their superiors say otherwise well then they will lose their job so in this way, those most in league with the Luciferian Space Aliens, that they of course don’t know the reality of are those that hold the highest positions in the religious organizations that formed as a result of the co-opting that started when the representative left.

As a side note:

Now Jesus is talking about how they, Jesus and his Father are one. They are of one mind because Jesus as his FAther’s son does only what his father gives him to do, but that is not at all saying they are the same person. It would be like someone is scuba diving to find some treasure and there is someone in the boat that can see what the camera is picking up that’s with the diver and based on their experience with what they are looking at telling the diver what to do. That diver who can hear and understand the directions is not the same person giving the instructions. The reason this is not written in a clearer way was because Jesus’ disciples weren’t quite ready to understand the reality of remote communications and just how real it is yet so he was leaving it more supernatural until their brains could further evolve along with science to show how that can be actually rather commonplace as it is now.

So here is the scriptural representation of my explanation above:

Joh 14:4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.
Joh 14:5 Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way?
Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Joh 14:7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
Joh 14:8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
Joh 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
Joh 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works’ sake.
Joh 14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

Note: The terms greater didn’t mean “better” but simply “more”. Some new age spiritualists use this scripture to say that Jesus said they would also be christs and even greater than jesus which is that same old Luciferian comondeering of the reality and shifting it to make himself look greater than he really is, and then reflecting that to the unsuspecting humans who he is in the ear of.

Joh 14:13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
Joh 14:14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

Getting back to the use of the term “abode”:
Notice how the metaphorical defintion in the bible program did not originate from Strongs but was added by whoever did the bible program and how that definition has a mystical/spiritual bent that results in someone thinking that Jesus is simply saying that God, the Holy Ghost (nothing about the Father who was clear in many of Jesus sayings was a person and a different person from Jesus) “indwells believers”, while Jesus is talking far more specifically to his disciples and hardly theorectical when they were having a hard enough time understanding.

But let’s look at the context by showing the previous related scriptures:

The setting is Jesus talking to his disciples which would not have been to the public as he was outlining what they could expect as he was explaining his departure from them but also saying he would be returning. Now when he was to return is a subject of debate of course. Some can think he was referring to his surviving his crucifixion a type of “standing up again”(resurrection). However, if this was the only passage then one would not know to what Jesus is referring by his “return” as he outlined many things that were to happen before his return which included his disciples being persecuted and some of them dying in support of their belief in him, which at this point would be hard to say is the same time period between the crusifixion and resurrection.

So oneward:

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Joh 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

Bible program defintion:
3306 meno {men’-o}
 a root word; TDNT – 4:574,581; v
 AV – abide 61, remain 16, dwell 15, continue 11, tarry 9, endure 3, misc 5; 120
 1) to remain, abide 1a) in reference to place 1a1) to sojourn, tarry 1a2) not to depart 1a2a) to continue to be present 1a2b) to be held, kept, continually 1b) in reference to time 1b1) to continue to be, not to perish, to last, endure 1b1a) of persons, to survive, live 1c) in reference to state or condition 1c1) to remain as one, not to become another or different 2) to wait for, await one

Now this defintion of “abide” does seem to suggest “remain” for this context.

Joh 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
Joh 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
Joh 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
Joh 14:20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.
Joh 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
Joh 14:22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?

Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

This is the biggest reference Jesus made to both he and his Father coming back, thus one must consider this to be the forcast of the return AS the TWO Witnesses in Revelations Chapter 11, as the Two Witnesses are associated with the Two Olive Trees and Two candlesticks = Two Anointed Ones, thus the same as saying TWO Christs.

Revelations 12 shows more of who these two are. One is a Woman about to give birth (Ti) and Do is about to be born, but more than Do as Ti is birthing Do’s litter, the saints those who have “washed their robes” (overcome the world).

And these are those who came out of the 144,000 seeds planted that have learned a new song that only they can know: Ti Do was taken from the notes: do re me fa so la ti. Ti and Do explained that to us as
Ti is the top of the scale and it’s through her efforts that she gives birth to the next octave Do.

Ti and Do felt the performance: The Sound of Music was like a type of outline of their task.

Maria is Ti and comes out of religion to find Do who has the children and thru her efforts helps reawaken Do to his task to all sing together and escape the clutches of the Luciferian Space Aliens who are taking over the world.

Rev 12 depicts this fairly well. Do told us he while in the military as a signal man spent some time in Salzburg, Austria on that very hill where Julie Andrews was filmed in the opening scene of the Sound of Music.

And do was a professional music director, opera singer and choral conductor for large Christian churchs while his vehicles dad was a minister who traveled all over Texas setting up churches.

And Do took the vehicle named: Applewhite for a reason. He was making the effort to help us brige the gap that formed when he, though the vehicle called adam chose to not follow instructions and ate the fruit that stimulated their libido and therefore showed the Next Level, his Father, the Lord that they’d have to learn the value of following instructions and who it is that is giving them, by having to fend for themselves.

Thus Apple was the representation of the missed opportunity and White is making that sin pure again.

If you were to follow Applewhites blood line I wonder what one would find. I haven’t done that yet so if anyone cares to do it, I’d be interested to hear any results.

All in all, I have shown how some of the coopting has taken place and continues to be in force.

Subtle changes end up being huge disguises if what is otherwise true and real, rendering them oridinary and mystical and esoteric and moreorless worthless and illusionary but something easy to cling to while thinking of ourselves as something special for doing so.

American’s and Nato soldiers are murdering afgans – You and all of us can still repent(change our mind and ways)

February 15, 2010

Let’s not play games. This is wholesale murder and the Kingdom of God knows it and will deal with all souls who participate and who have the ability to change it. None of us are really Americans as pertaining to the government because as far as the Kingdom of God is concerned there are no nations acting on their behalf no matter what various religious in any country say or think.

And for all the atheists and religionists and spiritualists that justify murdering and calling it “defense” they are liars to themselves and others.

Change you ways or die in your hatred and find the same kind of hatred after death. You are creating your own reality now and once dead. The only difference is once you are dead you can not change the things you did and believed in so you are then destined to enact that same behavior while in the spirit world, that is until the close upcoming recycling dissovlves your spirits in the “lake of fire”, possibly being sucked into the earth’s core somehow or just subject to a frequency shift, a result of a combo of sun and earth activity.

No matter what you have done to date, you can still repent (change your mind) and ask the Lord for forgiveness and then ask those you harmed for forgiveness, one by one as best you can. (If they don’t accept it’s that’s their choice).

And this goes for anyone who has hurt anyone no matter where you are and what level of hurt it was, physical and/or mental.

However if someone feels you have hurt them because you didn’t agree with them or ran out on them due to your inablity to work together (a two party responsability), when you tried to work things out or because you simply grew apart in some way or wanted to do something others didn’t approve of that wasn’t really anyone else’s business as what you were doing was not going to be hurting someone, then that is NOT something you’ve done to hurt someone else.

Now by hurt, that also includes manipulating others which is simply a form of deceit and deceit in that way is not God’s way. God understands not being totally honest with those that might throw you in jail because of being honest, when again, you know you did nothing to hurt another. (jesus addressed that – agree with your advasary while in the way with them otherwise you will find yourself before the judge and then in jail to pay a great price).

Q & A re Ti and Do’s Heaven’s Gate “cult” activities

February 15, 2010

1) I was just wondering if those in the Class were permitted to read other religious teachings. What was the symbolism behind the cut hair everyone had? I know the symbolism behind the regular clothes they were wearing. What happened if someone had too many questions? Were they frowned apon?

2) If someone studied the NL info, overcame all human ways and dropped their container with desperate pleads to the NL to be taken onto a craft even though a NL Rep is no longer present but his teachings are? RKKody and JSTody are two examples and half of me says yes and the other half says that people may be replanted. I dont know if the gate to the NL is closed or still open.

Sawyer’s response:

When I joined I brought with me what I wanted. No one ever searched me, though we were encouraged to turn in thing’s that could be sold or redistributed to others. If we had pot or tobacco, that was to be discarded or turned in. But 9 months later when we gathered in wyoming, we still had certain freedoms. We shopped and ate whatever foods we wanted, living in little tent groups. Ti and Do would give each group money that would be distributed to each tent of each group. Each tent had a partnership or threesome in it. We would wait for the go ahead to go shopping and we had no times set for eating, though that soon all changed. Once we got into houses, we had a small library. I remember seeing one on roswell but don’t really recall much, nor was I intested in books then.
We make the Jehovah Witnesses look tame in terms of totalitarian control. There is no real comparison with Jehovah Witnesses though. One is a human government or some humans who sought to mimic the previous next Level’s motis operendi. When you have the originator with you, there is no mimicing. If we tried to suggest or direct things somehow, you would have been asked to leave if they want something in the world.This wasn’t a club like religions are. Overcoming means discarding ALL our previous behaviors. It didn’t even matter if the new behaviors could be proven better. The point was being willing to do whatever.
Do you see a difference with religion and what I’m describing? I mean if I want to be a Jehovah Witnesses and so do you and we want to make up rules to join and someone joins and wants to break those rules then they should leave or they could reexamine the rules.
Yes, the NL worked hard to have freedome of religion in this north america. It’s what enabled them to survice for 24 years though it was still hard to not be interferred with.

2) If someone did all you said, (overcome their humaness, etc.) which I believe would be impossible to do without the hands on help from a member of the next level physically present, then I believe when they died whether by their own hand or another’s or from natural causes, their spirit/soul would be in the Next Level’s keeping. I don’t think they in general take someone physically unless they came from the Next Level, (jesus said that) as they don’t need humans for anything and they don’t populate their environment with “pets”, though younger members (those who just graduate) are apprentises and the Older members there know they are younger. But all members of the next level have servicability. They want tasks – activity – challenges – interesting things to do and they get what they want in that regard though it’s still up to each member to seek what they want (which department(s)) to work in and how fast they want to grow in that regards. Theorectically there is nothing that stops someone from even outgrowing an Older Member. It’s theorectical because that Older Member is also seeking continuous growth. However, it’s not a competition to where one would beat out another for some particular task. If two or more are stiving for the same position, the Next Level Older Members will make a new position in some equivilent department, however Next Level members are also very flexible and don’t get fixated on doing only certain things.

Cut hair for them was for several reasons – stands out less in today’s world, has less rebellion and individuality in it (as human desire for individuality needs to be ovecome), is easier to maintain and keep clean and perhaps may be less sensuous (as some people and discarnates are attracted to those who give a “bad” appearance and there may be some electromagnetic “antenna” as well. I can’t say that Ti and Do spelled this all out this way. A huge part of the classroom was simply doing the things Ti and Do gave us to do, whether we knew why or not. Sometiems they explained why and other times not. They were not ever trying to win us over to their thinking by doing lots of explaining.

Yes, one could have too many questions in that circumstance and the type of questions if too philosophical were discouraged. They definitely did not want to waste time.

We only read what Ti and Do provided us and they didn’t give us much religious materials. This wasn’t an eclectic religious study program. Most in the class had already studied many religions.

I don’t know what symbolism you are referring to, in terms of their choice of clothing(as I imagine you saw on the student exit tapes (still available on youtube). Symbolism was far and few between and actually only apparnt at their exit with the purple shrouds over each of their dead human vehicles. It was what was practical- looked neat, fit in with humans, covered or masked body shapes and gateways for others to have sensual attraction, gender neutral, affordable(Ti was always looking for sales- shopped at Marshalls often.), were not trying to be fashion conscious except to not stand out, what was required at jobs (out of craft tasks), but again another avenue to not have strong likes and dislikes about – willing to enjoy whatever they gave us to wear. And it needed to fit, and not cause allergic reactions (as some had) and were always kept clean.

Ti and Do were the GATE. If they are not hear the gate is not open. Being here also meant their being in the spirit world wherever that might have been. Personally I think Ti and Do have left the spirit world but I can’t prove that so theorectically the gate is still open. However Lucifer could try to use that to get rid of those that can still help others come closer to the next level – get them to exit thinking it’s the right thing to do. I tell folks who ask that question to talk to Do about what they want and not think they are going to be told outright by a voice or a ufo sighting or something magnificent to sway us. Now that’s not to say that talking with Do will be a long lasting opportunity of connecting. With Jesus, his name was quickly taken over by the lower forces who began to respond to all those who might have called on the name: Jesus. This was especially escalated as people that knew of Jesus, pro or con died. If they died hating Jesus then they would hate jesus while in spirit and should a living human seek to talk to Jesus, these jesus haters might respond, so it becomes a matter of how to identify the Older member more than using the address of their name. Now for those who did establish a physical relationship with jesus while he was present physically OR as a result of hearing about Jesus believed in him, then the Next Level would know who these souls are and would be keeping track of them, so that when they asked something in jesus name, he and/or his helpers would respond according to their instructions, as some could ask things the Next Level cares not to provide. It is all this real, in fact even more real than our reality in this way as we are led around by discarnate influences all the time and don’t generally know it or believe it. So the GATE that actually enables going with Do and his students as Do spoke to in his exit video, is for all intents and purposes closed, thus any who believe that much and overcome certain of their human ways, is all good but the task for would be students now is to dissemminate the information Ti and Do brought, word for word is best and give “glory” to them, rather than seek if for ourselves as they were the instigators and without them we wouldn’t even have had the experience we are having.

If students frowned on others that asked too many questions or whatever – made a nusence of themselves then they would be corrected as well. That did happen in many ways all the time. If we frowned on Ti and Do, it would be brought to their attention in private. Ti and Do knew when there were students entertaining critisism of them, though they didn’t know who was doing it unless they expressed it in some way. They didn’t try to “read” into us.

How the Creator crew’s “Kingdom”(God) interfaces with humans

February 15, 2010


What do you think of the zeitoun apperition… its very ufo esque?

Sawyer’s response:

I never heard of it, so on your prompting I will look into it, BUT I can be relatively 99% sure it’s not being done by the ones I’m talking about from the creator’s kingdom, as they don’t operate in the field of illusion or holograms or mystique – that’s the motis operendi of humans and human equivlients (fallen once potential children of god), all lumped into the term Luciferian Space Aliens. Any space aliens that are not in this category are distinguished by not trying to fool people into supporting them. They don’t necessarily work for the creator crew, though even the Luciferians do so, serving as fertilizer or like mind exercise machines or sparring partners for all those that seek to grown closer to the One True Creator Kingdom above human headed in this part of the Universe by Ti and “her” now adult “son” Do, aka Jesus, Moses, Elijah, Enoch and began this experiement by interfacing with the vehicle called adam the hebrew word for “man” (human).

When the next level members interface with us it’s “face to face” through their incarnation into a human vehicle. It’s an undercover way to get their foot in the door that is otherwise tightly shut on our minds because of the in depth programming allowed to take place but advanced upon all the human genetic strains on whatever planet is the current “garden”. And they come in ways we would see as angels but again not as dead human discarnate “spirits”. They still are using a type of physical body that can be seen and can clearly communicate and that others don’t know what to make of them really, but again it’s “face to face” and they often come in TWO’s – Lot’s TWO beings, AT Jesus tomb: TWO beings (though not all accounts), At Jesus’s ascension: TWO beings.

And the next level comes to humans  in dreams if those people have asked to have a closer relationship and help to be willing to do so as otherwise a human being would never want to change (until they are faced with trauma, though still may not consider that there are some that could help if they honestly asked for it). Otherwise the Next Level allows the existing systems to operate, that we call nature that is designed to challenge human beings to “wake up” and change their ways, again not forcing them to do so as we being human were all designed to perish, so those natural disasters are at most escalating the time and method of that death.

And the Next Level does at times directly killl weeds when they see that any part or the entire garden patch is too infested to allow their “fruit” to grow, as any human garderner does withiout concern for the rights and life of those predators but that is completely against the next level for humans to enact agaisnt other humans (at least at this phase of the overall garden project, as first ushered in by Jesus, though Jesus never preached “peace on Earth”, however that doesn’t mean he wouldn’t applaud all those who are peace on earth seekers because it is clearly more evolved behavior BUT “peace” to jesus was like saying: I’m content…everythuing is wonderful, I wouldn’t change anything – life is great”. And it’s not like jesus doesn’t want us to have a fulfilling life in whatever we do that includes having nice things – BUT he really doesn’t want us to “want” those things (as he knows how they are dead ends)  and especially in place of seeking a closer relationship with HIM. He’s not on an ego trip to get people to look to him either. It’s simply that he is any human’s ultimate parent and he knows how much we can have in his reality to include not perishing and not sufferring in the crude ways many humans are forced to suffer, should we seek to follow in our parents footsteps, while it always remains our choice.

But the idea of sufferring that is also very buddist to consider, as at least one of the buddhas – perhaps guatama taught that the path to this “enlightenment” does encompass sufferring. The word is distorted though as so many are. It’s really “thirst” and it’s counter part “effort” to try better reach for what is more but that provided lasting satisfaction, that also stimulated having yet more thirst. It’s the true process the puts one on a path of neverendign growth but it doesn’t work unless “change” accompanies it, not change just to change, though that can also have it’s value but change of “MIND” -(repenting) replacing human mind/ways with Next Level “whole” mind/ways.

false prophet/anti-maitreya/christ: Luciferian Space Alien pseudo spiritual RAEL

February 13, 2010

Now they are calling him maitreya Rael, almost like clockwork after I’ve been making comparisons between what maitreya really meant – the “enlightenment being” a bodhisatva the same meaning as the Buddha and the same meaning as the Christ which I did a show or two on and wrote a bunch of papers on. I’m not saying that they are now publically taking this terminology because of me. It’s simply timely, they and any others who are making this kind of claim at this time who have zero reflection of what ANY real Christ MUST represent, be, do, say and think and why – IS because of the Luciferian space aliens desperation to secure as many souls to their allegiance as possible. This is no longer even remotely a conspiracy theory or philosophical mindset or paranormal extra dimensional sci fi styled hollywood religious spiriuality – they are being forced to BE EXACTLY WHO THEY REALLY ARE. They can NOT do otherwise. Jesus was quoted to have said, “Where the carcus is the eagles will be gathered”. This is now so clear to me. The carcus are the “dead” former prospective “children of God/implanted with souls” that lost their soul and God connection by accepting the pie in the sky prince of peace luciferian peace on Earth space aliens doctrine thus part of the body of christ, souls that have decided to totally block out reality and they are literally locating themselves more and more to certain areas of the planet and have been for a long long time as they initially were drawn to where Ti and Do were incarnate and circulated. These souls are both mortal humans who were given souls by the next level when Ti and Do came this time and discarnate souls that were brought back by the next level, having once been implanted souls from any previous Next Level planting of souls on Earth or on any other planet within the range the Next Level had chosen to work with and by brought back included those in what the catholics call purgatory, or paradise (paradosa in greek), according to jewish understandings, “a walled area where God keeps souls temporarily, until the “last day” which has been in progress since Ti and Do and their crew’s return at the turn of the 20th century. Those souls all had the chance to interface with living bodies. There were 144,000 of them planted by the next level. A master gardener knows how many prize rose seeds they want to try to manage. They don’t waste precious seeds or plant willy nilly. So all these souls are and have been for generations been seeking receptive “vehicles” living human beings who were genetically prepared to accept what to others is preposterous (because they didn’t have that program to provide that real sense of reality of living physical beings in existence outside the Earth and their Next Level composition). And many of them found vehicles but as jesus says about seed planting, they were eaten/consumed by “birds” – literally predator creatures with no compassion whatsoever, descended from reptiles biologically thus related to the same origin that produced the reptilian aliens from draco who the next level has continuouls allowed to be an influence over humans (off and on – as the next level can turn them off and on at will) and can level the playing field by the repeated introduction of “truth” through their incarnate bodi satva, enlightenment annointed beings. The luciferican space aliens, know their time is short to reap what they want from the earth in the REVelations “second harvest”. They know this because it’s been done before – this garden and any garden they have had any relationship has experienced being recycled many times but they don’t know why exactly. Some think humans bring it to a recycle point and in some ways that’s true. If humans didn’t turn into greedy predators or pleasure addicts – hedonites (just a choice but a choice that simply leads to perishing, which many don’t care about and why should they, they are nothing becasue they never sought to become anything,that is in the eyes of the next level and the next level is the government over all, who decide the criteria of who has some potential viability for future garden projects. We who are beginning to see this more and more are also being put to the test. It is no longer a casual condition. We all are being forced to decide where to put our allegience and there are only three possabilies, though two boil down to one, so in reality there are only two possabilties: For or Against the true next level above human as represented by the fulll strain of next level membership that includes: Adam, Enoch, Moses, Elijah, Jesus and Do – the six olive branches of the israeli menora, The Lord/Father/Older Member: Ti being the lampstand where all the Oil is supplied to the branches that is the blood(mind) that is sacrificed by fire, burning in their lamps that provide “light and understanding” for all to be able to see and understand. In between, undecided is the one that really boils down to against. My last show on was all about the Two Olive Trees,the Two lampstands as just as Ti is one lampstand, Do is also a lampstand, so between them there are two layers of “churches”, each being 12, 000 soul seeds for a total of 6 times 2 = 12 overall churches all at varying levels of progress towards possible graduation/harvest. Zecheria was given the prophecy of both Jesus and Ti and Do, as the Two Witnesses(greek martus=those willing to tell the honest truth about the next level who by doing so eventually die, become martyrs for Christ, though the Luciferians provide many pseudo, facsimili christs, that are hopelessly not even a close match for those given the key to see, available for the asking/seeking, that is the body of information provided by the next level throughout it’s garden experiment, that can taste so good to the brain/taste buds of the mind because of the phenomenal truth the words portray, but to put into application makes one’s stomach queezy and bitter because the human vehicle does not want to not have whatever it has become accustomed to have.) If you have an address for a raelian and want to forward this or anything I do or say you are welcome to but they are probably among the “carcus” now having decided what to entrench in giving homage to. take care – there is a bumpy road ahead for all earthlings but we can see it through if we seek connection with the One True Kingdom of God, though their latest lampstand/olive tree (christs, according to zecharia). The sign of the next level is represented by the number TWO. When you see things done in two’s or by TWO beings (though lucifer is busy at this time and has been for some time trying to create facsimili’s of that also),then pay special attention. halebopp had TWO tails as seen by hubble photographs. And recently a discovery baffling scientists as they witness two planets circling a star and the two planets are hotter and brighter than the star they are in orbit around. sincerely, sawyer Here is the email sent to their mailing lists that was forwarded to me and I have spoken of above: Dear Raelian Sympathizers, old friends and new friends, Well we are only 11 weeks away before hundreds of open minded beings descend on the city of Las Vegas to indulge in 8 days of the most fantastic fun and pleasure your senses can experience….(03/24/10 – 04/04/10). Would you like to “BECOME THE MASTER OF YOUR HAPPINESS”? Imagine trying to describe your first sunset, or the first time you felt love, or even to try and explain the feeling you have when you listen to your favorite music or song… Words will never compare to reality. It’s the same for this 8 day adventure with the Maitreya Rael and the amazing people that come to share it from all over the world. There are no words but rather an experience you’ll take with you, forever. What you will be able to live in eight days will be one of the most important journeys you’ve ever taken because you will discover this immense potential within you. You will learn ways in which to express the most unique “you” that you possibly can – and discover the ways to become the master of your own happiness. Remember, you do not have to be a member or Raelian to attend this “Happiness Academy”; ANYONE can come, no matter their walk of life or beliefs! It is for all those who are open minded or wish to be more so! So come and live these moments with all of us and discover the clear, concise, loving and humorous teachings of the Elohim’s messenger, Maitreya Rael to discover this immense potential within you to become the master of your happiness. Please go to the link below to register for this 8 day adventure. We have extended your pleasure for and extra day so please make your arrangements to leave on Sunday night April 4th or Monday morning April 5th as we will continue the fun until Sunday at 5pm. We look forward to meeting each and every one of you and promise you will have the best 8 days of your life. Fraternel Love, Lara Terstenjak, US National Guide ******************************************************* Queridos simpatizantes, raelianos, viejos y nuevos amigos, Estamos a sólo 11 semanas de recibir en la ciudad de las Vegas a cientos de seres de mente abierta, para disfrutar 8 días fantasticos de diversión y placer que tus sentidos van a experimentar ….( 03/24/10 a 04/04 /10). “CONVIERTETE EN EL AMO DE TU FELICIDAD” Imagínate tratando de describir tu primer atardecer, o la primera vez que te enamoraste, o trata de explicar lo que sientes cuando escuchas tu música o canción favorita … Las palabras jamás podrán reflejar la realidad. Sucederá lo mismo con esta aventura de siete días con Maitreya Rael y la gente increíble que vienen a compartirla de todos los rincones de la tierra. No existen palabras, mas bien una experiencia es lo que te llevarás contigo, para siempre. Lo que lograrás vivir en siete días será una de las travesías mas importantes en las que te has embarcado hasta ahora porque descubrirás este potencial enorme dentro de ti. Aprenderás formas por las cuales expresar el mas único “tu” de que eres capaz y descubrir las formas de convertirte en el amo de tu felicidad. Acuérdate, tú no tienes que ser miembro o Raeliano para atender este seminario, QUIEN QUIERA puede venir, sin importar su situación o creencias! Es para todos aquellos con una mente abierta o que quieran abrirla más! Ven a vivir estos momentos con todos nosotros y descubre las claras, concisas, amorosas y humorosas enseñanzas del Maitreya Rael, mensajero de los Elohim, para descubrir este enorme potencial dentro de ti para convertirte en el amo de tu felicidad. INSCRIPCION:Por favor, ve al enlace de abajo para inscribirte a esta aventura de 8 días. Extendimos tu placer un día más. Asi que por favor haz tus preparativos para salir la noche del domingo 4 de abril o la mañana del lunes 5 de abril, dado que continuaremos divirtiendonos hasta el domingo a las 5pm. Tenemos tantas ganas de conocer a cada uno de ustedes. Les prometemos que tendran los mejores 8 días de su vida!! Con amor fraternal Lara Terstenjak, Guia Nacional EEUU

No cool aid for us & Ti and Do’s humor

February 13, 2010

I have created this compliation of a discussion board on my facebook Sawyer HeavensGate account. The group I am speaking about is the group known as Heaven’s Gate, the 39 people who in 1997 layed down their physical lives in sync with the Hale Bopp comet’s closest point to Earth which was on the spring solstice of 1997, which was the “resurrection (standing up – becoming existant (Yahovah) of the “dead in Christ” from among the soon to be spiriutally dead, those who remain that have not decided where their allegience is. This was the only legitimate “second coming” of the annointed ones (Two Witnesses(martus), Two Olive Trees, Two lampstands (christs/buddha’s) as promised by many traditional religious belief systems/record books (that hold both true and distorted records of the One True many membered Physical Evolutionary Level Above Human (above human and above human equivilent Luciferian styled space aliens) relationship with humans universally, spoken of as the Kingdom of God, of Heaven, located in the deep space literal stars/outer space/heavens).

All prophesies among many tradtions and cultures pointed to this event. I, Sawyer was a member of Ti and Do’s (Father and Son) team for 19 years and thus have an obligation to serve them as best I can which brings me to the following discussion, one of many on Facebook:

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote:

I love humor. In the group with Ti and Do we had lots of humor as was displayed by some of the exit video’s, largly ollody with the funny hat that he wore. I forget where we got that Dr. Seuss like hat but that was only one reflection of ollody (cabot’s) personality.

However, humor aside, their exit was of course not humorous for those who still felt connection to them, mostly as family members, though in 99% of them they had long ago introduced the change of their love and loyalties, not something we who remain are meant to do at all, though to really become a member in their world(society, environment, abodes, lifestyle, membership, communit), requires a pass through the initial gate that puts us only on the docket for a future growth towards membership opportunity.

The first step is simply to believe in them (Yes the same thing the christians say and even other religions, but largly misapply as meaning someone else gives us the pie in the sky entirely by our belief and slight adherence to basic morality (that has also been twisted to be based only on sexuality and it’s forms)).

After belief, comes works. The grace is what the real Kingdom of God offers us which no religious institution nor offshoot sect offers. Of course the kingdom is actually quite the real place and is a natural evoltuionary step that humans are prepared for by the Next Level. The preparation humans are given is the “grace” the water that the horse is provided to drink, that tells the horse to not be afraid.

Humans and various behind the scenes “influences” are what interject fear and guilt and all that religious dogma – celebration and condemnation of others. The members of the evolutionary level above human don’t need to inflict any of that on us, though they do at times weed the garden they created for the purpose of raising potential young to their world.

Ti and Do said that the human kingdom was not designed to work in the sense of being a final place to arrive at and not move on from. And that’s “human”. Just traveling in outer space doesn’t make us less human any more than a dog in a car with humans makes them a human. Thus space aliens are no more than human dogs in high tech cars. Right now as we speak humans are in the process of becoming potential space aliens to somewhere else, that is if the Level Above Human allows them.

Since I’ve already gone way beyond the title and am accused all the time of wordiness I’ll close this communication with the “no kool aid” part. At the stage of new believers there is absolutely no kool aid allowed and escpecially when the older members have left their physical “incarnation” with us and especially because we each need lots and lots of duration of self examination and self discipline involving mind and matter (which is where various religions get the idea in the first place, all being related to past experiences with the Level Above Human’s Gardening efforts that started long before adam and eve, simply the latest experiment cycle).

At this time, it only to understand why they left the way they did. I don’t know if that exact method is the way it’s mostly done, but the end of our physical life is part of being human and is the biggest aspect of demonstrating our resolve – as Jesus said in many ways and Moses alluded to and disciples of each demonstrated.

The serious believers must begin to breach their fear of coming into disfavour with others and that is largly accomplished by sharing difficult to share and largly unpopular information whiich at certain times in a civilization does prove to escalate one’s physical demise, but who the Next Level keeps track of so to “save” their soul for a future opportunity to be brought back (the real origin of the idea of reincarnation, that does not entail actually being embedded in the vehicle, which can not be done except by a spirit attempting to do their thing through those with a physical body, thus coming back again), what Jesus referred to in his expression to the thief on the cross next to him because of his “belief”, but that has been misconstrued to mean all he needed to do is believe to have full membership) for a next phase in that evolution of mind/body towards eventual harvest/graduation.

But if people join groups like this and think by joining they are insuring a relationship to the Next Level, they are sadly mistaken just like many of the religious who think and have been programmed the same, to include the new age spiritualists and their various clubs and practices and techniques, all their dogma that I am an atheist (non believer in), though some of the practices can be beneficial for us to help us physically and mentally. It’s simply that they don’t lead to God Kingdom membership and we don’t become dieties just by saying we are, because sure the creators energy is what feeds us all so in that way it’s in us all, but it’s like having a gene that gets expressed less and less. Pretty soon that god gene has no application so atrophies.

So yes to beilef and dissemenation of Ti and Do’s information and no to kool aid, but I guess I need to keep that last part quite and the makers of kool aid may sue me for deformation of their product.

Ferg wrote on December 16, 2009 at 12:43pm

were you in heavens gate, i would like to hear more about ti and do their beliefs and what it must have been like there…please respond

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote on December 17, 2009 at 11:43am

Yes. I joined with them at the inception of Ti and Do’s coming public in 1975, then using the names Bo and Peep (but in revese name order which would have been Peep and Bo). It was no less than a whirlwind experience, none of which ever showed any signs of hypocricsy, deceit, powermongering, egotism, greed, cruelty or negativity of any kind, though was certainly a tight knit organization with very high escalating standards of behaviour and “ways”. The emphasis always being on self control and restraint in thought, word and deed. Our bodies were our tools, so they were treated exceptionally well, though not entirely in the best ways for complete human health but to complete the task of transformation/metamorphosis – overcoming to enable the development of our “soul” body. For instance we were all celebate in mind(according to each members personal discipline, with the aim of being totally without sexual thoughts or feelings) and in body(not actually allowing our bodies to masturbate or be in situations that could stimulate those systems(which of course goes hand in hand with our own mind control over our brain/body). It would take literal volumes and volumes to describe all that it entailed, but let me say that it was nothing like it’s been portrayed by any media. There was no ritual, dogma, no heirarchy (though it was quite clear who the teachers were. They didn’t have to tell us that. They treated each of us as their children whom they loved. I remember how funny it seemed when they would refer to lggody as their “kido” in fun when he was in his late 50’s (at that time) and had been in the world a very well to do Colorado horse rancher with 4 grown children and was a grandfather, that he had left beind to join with Ti and Do. But it was clear that no matter our accomplishments, talents and skills in the world, we were all their children and it wasn’t in terms of discipline over us at all. I never saw they speak down to anyone. I never saw them speak angrily. However, I did see Ti (Do’s Older Member(heavenly Father) speak emphatically one time out of frustration with our group growth as they very much taylored the lesson plan to the so called slowest students. By slow, it wasn’t a put down – but what it really came down to was who could/would weather the storm of bombardment from “unseen” influences that would do anything to get us to change from this direction we were all so compelled to press on with. And they were not without emotion and self critisim and they did struggle with how to help particular students. They hardly ever generalized anything. They were always very thorough and sought to create a positive from every seeming negative but if someone wanted to leave, they were free to, though most left secretly (not to face Ti and Do) or because they were asked/told to leave (19 in the first year were seperated from the other ~70 at that point, while 2 were asked to leave because they did not want to abopt a major lesson step entitled “I could be wrong” which had to do with what Jesus called “thy will be done” or “deny yourself”, redirecting our all to our Older Members, which for us was primarily to Do as he was our Older Member while Ti was like our grandfather in the experience levels of the Evolutionary Level Above Human’s natural heirarchy). I left them in 1994 after talking with Do. It was certainly a failure on my part, according to my strong desire to be there with all my heart, mind, soul and strength, but I did not have to leave. It’s a long story and I have no problem telling it, but let me just say for now that it was not because I disaggreed with them or had any kind of falling out or a desire to do something in the world. The surface reason was because I gave into sensuality with myself – I began to entertain sexual feelings and images and engaged in masturbation and for some strange reason lacked even the desire to re-gain my past successes which were quite good or so it seemed for 18 years before then. It took me some 10 years after leaving to really see what had happened. When I left I wanted
nothing but they insisted in giving me $600 and a plane ticket to wherever I wanted to go. I have written about this on one of my blogs and by the way I do a radio broadcast most thursday nights 11pm-1am ET on that you can hear over the internet and chat too and/or call into to listen and/or converse with me, at which time I’d be glad to elaborate on anything. (I am NOT recruting and am NOT telling anyone that they should or would please Ti and Do at this time by “laying down their life”. That was for them at that time and was well prepared for.

Ferg wrote on December 17, 2009 at 7:30pm

your a strong person, some of the questions i have for you seem strange for me to ask, like, did they castrate themselves? certain things ive done to myself in the past (sleep depravation, starvation, (other weird stuff id rather not mention at this time) affected me in the way that i think maybe they felt (the people in heavens gate – if only in a small way) the other question ill refrain from asking because the im not really sure as to why im curious about it… (ill save it for another conversation perhaps) im going to check out your blog and the radio broadcast also … i feel so glad im able to talk to you… you were there, you talked to do, somewhere inside me feels like they were protected, together there in the house, free from sin (body) in their minds they were free, open mindedness takes the soul away from this body, away from this earth, they were warm, they were free to choose to leave… the philosophy, abstaining from sexual pleasures is hard for me to do… im surrounded by it, that is my sin, my life, my skin… the more i destroy myself with the way i live the more i know deep down in my heart im hurting myself… im glad i have someone to talk to … thanks for responding

Ferg wrote on December 17, 2009 at 8:35pm
amazing radio broadcast.

Ferg wrote on December 17, 2009 at 10:02pm
really enjoyed listening, keep up the good work…

“if i survive this, ill never turn away from you again”

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote on December 18, 2009 at 12:56pm

Hi, glad to have your friendship and conversation. I apologize ahead of time, if you were in the chat room trying to communicate with me or if you called, as I have a hard enough time staying on the threads of information so I often don’t pay attention to the switchboard. And my blog is not very good or up to date. There is so, so much to say and I’ve written tons but lack time and organization to post it all, but another place where I have posted in on under the name swyody (my classroom name, as Sawyer was early on in the classroom, before the “adoption” by Ti and Do.

re: castration. All were not castrated. I forget now, if it was 5 or 6 males that chose to. I was determined to be as well and I have a long story to tell about that. Actually, if you have time, I did talk about it on one of my previous broadcasts which is available to listen to online and/or download for free if you want to look for the details. Let me just say now that it was years of consideration by Do to allow some students to seek out the service of reducing their testosterone production in that way but it wasn’t encouraged at all, though Do was the first one to introduce the fact that he was considering doing so to himself, but he was not the first, which was unusual. Srrody was the first. I flipped a coin with srrody to be the first and I lost the toss. I reported that to time magazine or maybe it was newsweek when I was interviewed and used in articles in 1997 and they got a hoot out of my saying, “I lost the toss to be castrated”. But after I left Do gave the go ahead to certain students who he felt were prepared for doing so but they still had to seek it out themselves from a doctor and they actually lived outside the classroom for the time of the operation and got jobs to pay for it, which I believe Do did as well as he did eventually also castrate himself. I wasn’t there for any castrations besides srrody’s. There was a complication with srrody’s as we did it ourselves. Lvvody was a registered nurse and she worked for a year or so with a surgeon who did orchectomy’s (sp?), the removal of testicles for testicular cancer so she knew the routine. Do had her get all the proper tools and they set up a room for surgury that was sterile and one day srrody and I were called to come to where they were as the room was in their “craft” where Do was residing with two classmates who served as his “helpers”. He chose females as helpers as he, his vehicle had even before awakening to his task in 1972 moreorless left the hedorsexual world, thus was openly “gay”, though he was also at that time distraught with all his sexuality and I don’t know if he was virturally non-sexual for a period before meeting Ti, who he was never sexual with at all. Anyway the complication with srrody’s surgury was minor and remedied in a hospita in literally a couple days timel. I was there for all of it so I know, but as a result Do felt that he couldn’t allow me to go ahead with my castration that I recall being disappointed about. On the day we were deciding who would go first, srrody or me, Do asked me if I had any reservations. This was after years of my petitioning Do to allow me to have it done. I had decent control over my sexuality but what I didn’t know is how protected we were in the classroom from discarnates and even space alien transmissions that human vehicles are suseptible to that moreorless simply push the button and it can be almost impossible to control. The Next Level crew regulated how much of an attach their students could be subjected to. I learned that big time in a number of ways. Do didn’t allow us to do the castration for those years because he wasn’t sure Ti approved. He didn’t get a clear indication so he didn’t approve it.That’s the way they always operated. He expressed that he didn’t want to tamper with the balance of each student’s vehicles makeup that was the grounds of what needed to be worked against to build their “next Level mind” that would result in a viable birth, but it seems after I left by giving into sexuality (in a real sense actually a secondary aspect as the larger lesson for me was the fact that I had not overcome my ego, my desire to be special, another long story).

Now, regarding what you said about the sin of sexuality for pleasure. Yes, it certainly has escalated into an addiction for many or even most humans, but it does no good to amass guilt for such indulgence as we are operating programed human vehicles that were bred to seek sensory satisfaction and it’s not just through sexuality. Some in the class had no problems with sexual desire but they had addiction to their own sense of inflated value so much so that they could not hardly observe anyone else without being critical, thinking that they could do a better job or see more, and would experience a type of gloating about their own value. We see this big time in the new age spirituality mindsets, like with the “oneness” people, etc. But re: sexuality, in the class it certainly came up that especially males would occasionally have nocternal emmissions, largely from the fact that even the digestive system is connected to testosterone development and even the processing of energy from the Next Level best thought of as their love for us, in the way they give of themselves to us in attention and opportunity that when entering the human vehicle/mind/soul stimulates the vehicle and the vehicle seeks to relieve itself of that energy according to the ways it is genetically and socially programmed to doing, often through loving relationships with other beings, often sexually. To reverse that programming may be near impossible entirely while still operating as a human. That’s not a reason to not try, but even with effort to minimize that activity or to go cold turkey will not entirely hault the processes, which Do addressed, when we’d report that we had a nocternal emmission, that if you did nothing to stimulate it, like touching oneself or entertaining thoughts, etc, then you’ve done the best you could, so don’t need to dwell on feeling guilty because it’s just the relief valve letting that energy off the top. It’s not a way to justify continued sexual pleasure indulgencesk, it’s a perspective that is not so damning, as many of the religious make it seem with all their judgementalism. jesus didn’t say sex was a sin(missing the mark) but he certainly demonstrated that it was necessary to overcome for “sake of membership in the KIngdom of Heaven”, though that’s been distored into a way to segregate people into categories of holiness – the priests and monks vs the lay believers that Paul of Tarsus led the way in constructing. Becoming a monk can have it’s value but if it’s not for the right reasons and/or not under the direct physical tutoring of a genuine member of the Next Level, it can actually entrench one into thinking they are serving God by their celebacy when they are more in service to a false God. Certainly sexuality is among the biggest addictions that turns our eyes to sense gratification and therefore away from “giving our all to the next level”. As I mentioned, food is also a big form of sense gratifcation and I saw that big time in the classroom. One classmate at one point hide an apple under their mattress. We were never starved, though we did have all sorts of guidelines surrounding food consumption, but it wasn’t an area I had any problem with, so it looked trivial to me to hide food. In the classroom we didnt’ go to the refrigerator whenever we might want to. Ti and Do were trying to help us break the many habits people have surrounding foods, likes and dislikes, when to eat, volume to consume and it’s priority and what happens if we don’t get it. This discussion can be elaborated on a great deal but I’ll save that and instead try to focus on how we can please the next level now that was provided us in writing by Do and by jwnody a closer helper to Do, whom I also worked with and did some public presentations with, who wrote some documents that are posted on the web site. In one in particular she said that, to be “saved”, meaning qualifying for a future progam to eventually overcome the world and graduate the human evolutionary kingdom, the process now is to simply “believe in Ti and Do, which would
include all they were about (though that is a continuous adventure, since I’m still discovering how much I failed to absorb of their teachings) and the second part of that is to demonstrate that belief by telling others about Ti and Do – that’s the taking up of one’s cross part, that Jesus was very clear about, called “cross bearing” because, though we don’t try to stimulate hatred against us, it will come so there will be ramifications to sharing what is otherwise completly unpopular, but being willing to take baby steps and more in that direction, which includes asking Ti and Do how and when and to whom and taking stabs at it, allows us to grow more connected to Ti and Do and to then receive more of their “mind”. The main object of the classroom is to take one’s mind off of self and put one’s mind more and more onto their Older Member. Doing so will assist in fluffing off certain human characteristics. It doesn’t involve judgeing anyone worthy or not, though one should keep in mind that it does no good to throw pearls before those that would trample them and even use them against us as we want to be able to maximize whatever time is left to share this info as a time will come when the jig is up and the Next Level is satisfied that they gave anyone that had a running chance enough chances. If you ever did decide to do something akin to a castration which I am not encouraging or discouraging, I would keep it between yourself and your Older Member who I believe to be Do as it’s very easy to by taking such an action to then think of yourself as advanced above others, which is yet another addiction that we can see throughout all the religious and new age spiritual groups, though they talk humility. Jesus put it this way. When you give alms, don’t let your right hand know what your left hand is doing and do so in secret, the same way to pray (ask for help, strength, the Older Member’s will (how we might serve better or next, which is a never ending advancement for those seeking to move into the next level.))

Ferg wrote on December 21, 2009 at 4:51pm

thanks for responding to my question in such detail, with such haste, ive been out of town for the past couple of days sorry i couldnt respond sooner. i think that if someone were to castrate themselves they would have a clearer train of thought, (wouldnt worry so much about the flesh) ive watched a lot of the movies with Do and am pleased that i can listen to his teachings… im also very glad i can ask you about my questions and listen to your advice, im going to make it a point to check out the broadcasts that i missed and look forward to hearing you speak on thursday again. Have a wonderful day happy holidays this season!

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote on December 21, 2009 at 6:26pm

did you see the beyond human series of video tapes of Do on youtube? If so on the first one and actually on a few others after that you will see my younger clean shaven, short haired classroom appearance sitting next to jwnody, one of my classmates in a female vehicle who I worked a lot with. She, as well as others also wrote a bunch of statements that are posted on free for download. And if you want to download and listen to tapes of Ti and Do talking to students in the 1980’s they are at:

Let me know if you have any problems accessing any of this information. I will also try to post things on my various blogs as well. I just lack time to do all I want to do. Oh, yes I have a youtube channel named: 3spm where I’ve posted several simple video’s I garage produced.

Other than that I’m glad to answer any questions honestly as I have nothing to hide and I guess I’ll see you on the broadcasts. Give me a sign if your in the chat room so I know it’s you.

and thanks for the holiday wishes. I like this time of year if only for at least the sense that it’s about Jesus and the Next Level though it’s such a commercial enterprise. The other day my 12 yr old girl told me to stop talking about Jesus and I said to her, do you know what christmas is and I told her it was jesus birthday (representatively) and she hadn’t remembered that. She’s in her own world and I don’t try to indoctrinate her though I do try to let her know what I believe.

I wish you a great holiday as well. That’s some strange looking icon your using. I’m not sure what that is.
Ferg wrote on December 22, 2009 at 1:19pm
i was listening to all the beyond human series but i had other tabs open ill check that out as well as the older recordings of Ti and Do. Ive looked at some of the videos from the 3rd stone peoples movement (pretty cool stuff) but ill have to give it another look im sure theres more info there… ill give you heads up if im able to make it thurs. funny story about your daughter heh 🙂 Merry Christmas 😛 the avatar picture is of beaker from the muppet babies on some cartoon I changed it to the muppet version, look familiar ?

Ferg wrote on December 23, 2009 at 6:56pm
ill try to make it to the broadcast tomorrow, later!

Graz wrote on January 14, 2010 at 7:07pm
avatar is going to be great. i will be swatting aliens like they were mosquitos. particularly if the ganja cookies ive cooked hit the spot. they did for les claypool. so im feeling pretty confident

Graz wrote:
im just curious ferg. why do u think enjoying sexual pleasures is a sin?

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote:

I know you were addressing Ferg but I’m going to weigh in a bit. It’s only a “sin” for those that want it to be a “sin”. In other words, the term “sin” which has all this conotation of being bad to do, should never have been translated into one word. There are hundreds of words like this in the record books some of which are compiled in the book called the Bible. Sin ment “missed the mark”.

When someone sets up a goal and they don’t hit it as well as they’d like then they simply missed it, so what do they do. Well if they want to try again they do. If they don’t they don’t. It’s really just that simple, though I haven’t addressed sexualty and pleasure at all, nor your ganja cookies.

Graz wrote:
thats actually quite insightful. so in fact when people say its a sin they are infact claiming what ever it maybe in reference to its only sinful to them because they believe it to be. thats interesting.

of course i dont believe sexual pleasure and ganja cookies are sinful as they do not harm other people or animals. well not yet at least.

Ferg wrote:
the mind is a part of the body so sexual thoughts can distract (spell?) the mind from actual relization of whats going on around you (the important things) so being all caught up in the body and the flesh is kind of sinful

Ferg wrote:
missed the end of last weeks broadcast and yesterdays – bummer

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote:

The podcast is available for free download at the site if you want to catch up.
I presented some results from this weeks research of how the Level Above Human members do have phyisical “flesh” bodies, though the “flesh” is of a different quality spoken of as “celestial flesh” that thrives by the force of the soulbody that occupys it but also benefits from external light photosynthesis.

The other aspect I find increasingly interesting is that one “key” to indentify Next Level members and interface with humans on Earth, via “signs” and via face to face relationships, again some of which evident in the historic records is: “Two”, as in Two Witnesses and Two Lampstands, and Two Olive Trees, etc. the incidents of Two angles in at least three occasions, etc.

I will have a paper about this but there is evidence that the “second coming” as it’s called would be TWO people from that Kingdom and of course I am convinced it was Ti and Do for many reasons and I am also about to provide a detailed analysis of the book of revelations, sort of a chapter at a time but chapter 12 indicates that one of those Two witnesses would be in a female body.

So that’s a tiny synopsis of last nights broadcast.

Ferg wrote:
what text refers to the two lampstands?

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote:

rev 11 and in Zechariah 4: Below with my added interpretation of the last verse. Zech doesn’t speak to Two candlestick/lampstands, just one but ties in the 2 olive trees around 1 lampstand in the middle.

It’s interesting how each lampstand has 6 branches, thus times two is 12 branches – the 12 churches or groups of believers since the current experiment began, I was looking at as the souls that were planted by each visit from a member of the Next Level (though the same crew each time and same multigenerational hands on application (Father and Son, Older and Younger member (though both our Older members). It’s origin comes from the menora given to build by the Lord to moses for use in the holy of holies. Ti and Do treated their quarters as a holy of holies. When camping their tent was a little more removed from the others, at first in an area even a 1/2 miles away, but gradually closer and then when they had a small trailor students were prohibited from walking around the back of the trailor and would only come up to the front when they asked us to. I always wondered why. I know many would think they were trying to hide something but I don’t think that was it. I Mean they had curtains and blinds on the windows so if they wanted to they could hide themselves. I think it had to do with the discarnates each of us naturally entertained. As students left and remaining students got under control or even rid of certain discarnates, it seemed they could be closer and closer to us physically. They actually did talk about that. We and our discarnates and general negative thinking that again was to be expected to have as that is in large part what most needs to be under control, overcome,which when your seeking to graduate means everythng other than what the older members give us to think about and do is negative but they only coached us on that cleansing process gradually according to the slowest student (that wasn’t for other students to determine).

Anyway, here is the zech section but I suggest you search for everythign to do with lamps and candlesticks and olive trees and branches and oil and if yiou have time, look at the hebrew and/or greek of whatever english words you can, to broaden the flavour and even meanings. Theres plenty of free bible software to download and strongs concordance is online to help with that. Strongs just doesn’t have a good search tool though it does have the versus and hebrew and greek word meanings.

Zec 4:1 And the angel that talked with me came again, and waked me, as a man that is wakened out of his sleep.
Zec 4:2 And said unto me, What seest thou? And I said, I have looked, and behold a candlestick all of gold, with a bowl upon the top of it, and his seven lamps thereon, and seven pipes to the seven lamps, which are upon the top thereof:
Zec 4:3 And two olive trees by it, one upon the right side of the bowl, and the other upon the left side thereof.
Zec 4:4 So I answered and spake to the angel that talked with me, saying, What are these, my lord?
Zec 4:5 Then the angel that talked with me answered and said unto me, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
Zec 4:6 Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts.
Zec 4:7 Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain: and he shall bring forth the headstone thereof with shoutings, crying, Grace, grace unto it.
Zec 4:8 Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Zec 4:9 The hands of Zerubbabel have laid the foundation of this house; his hands shall also finish it; and thou shalt know that the LORD of hosts hath sent me unto you.
Zec 4:10 For who hath despised the day of small things? for they shall rejoice, and shall see the plummet in the hand of Zerubbabel with those seven; they are the eyes of the LORD, which run to and fro through the whole earth.
Zec 4:11 Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?
Zec 4:12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
Zec 4:13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.

Here is the clincher that is saying that these two olive trees ARE Christs, thus the so called Second Coming, though as this was said before Jesus and his Father came, it would also work as a prophecy of them as well.

Zec 4:14 Then said he, These are the two anointed(consecrated light producers) ones(son/grandson – member of a group, of God), that stand(appointed,establish,endure) by the LORD of the whole earth.
Post #23Mark Versteeg (University of Sydney) wrote13 hours ago
I am just wondering if you believe or feel that the descriptions given are in fact a mechanism of vetting the true believers (or at least thoes who are truely ready for the next level) from the ones who are not. In other words, a methodology of almost selecting people for thier analytical abilities so that a consistant attribute of flexibility can be ensured?

After watching the “beyond human series” I often wonder what Do would say with regard to world events since his exit in terms of recycling. I consider a few years here and there to be negligable in terms of human and geologic history. I did think that perhaps the war on terror and the natural disasters that have occured since 1998 could perhaps be viewed through the lens of “recycling” and the lead up to a spading under.

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote:

Yes I do agree that the Next Level is vetting. The classroom was that from the get go though I didn’t think of it that way at the time. Look at the facts. They put out the message from 1973-mid-1975 when Ti in April called that part of the “harvest” closed. After probably some 200 or so becamse followers in that time period, 96 remained but no conscious vetting had begun. We gathered in veedavou area of the medicine bow national forest in southern wyoming and began to have meetings with Ti and do, still spoken of by us as Bo and Peep (Do and Ti). The message was a catch all that could appeal to religious and non-religious, but only really to the fringe of any number of belief or non-belief systems, in part that their language was designed to appeal to in calling their offerring Human Individual Metamorposis and as a task for the Evolutionary Level Above Human, a physical place of many members that we were prospective candidates for membership if we were willing to give our all to enter the “process” equated with a metamorphosis to emerge a new creature without the previous kingdom level limitations. These terms shot accross the bow of virtually everyone. All of a sudden the pagans were uplifted as it was a “many membered kingdom” not just a Father, Son and Holy Ghost and some etheric angles of some sort. It was physical, no longer thought again as etheric and non-matter related (though their bodies were considered to be made of a different biological structure than humans, as it even indicates in 3-4 biblical records), which would appeal to the more practical minded. They spoke in terms of this next level being evolutionary thus aligned with “nature” in a progressive fashion where there was an evolution of both mind(spirit/soul) and body/flesh and it’s facilities – everlasting, etc. They addressed the spirit world as an undesirable pursuit. They called “discarnates” Influences taking some of the mystic away, as did the other terminology jiving with how jesus said upon his return he would speak “plainly” of the kingdom, no longer in story and largely symbolic or figurative form, (though that still exists in the examples Ti and Do used of humans being like wild horses captured by the rancher to try to tame into voluntary service). And they aligned with the judaic/christian and to some degree buddist/islamic religious movements by reference to their being the Two Witnesses in rev 11 that goes back into the two lampstands and the two olive trees, etc. They at that time expected to be bumped off nearly right away and there certainly was great hatred of them and their message, that I witnessed first hand but which they did seek to avoid though were willing to give themselves over to. It’s interesting that the greek word for “witnesses” is rooted in “martus” meaning “giving honest testimony with the prospect of being killed for doing so” – martyrdom (which any desire among the students conscious or subconscious was actually considered to be something to additionally overcome because largly that idea of becoming a martyr was yet another ego trap – doing so to be “special” or a “hero” instead of the result of simply revealing new and challenging updated truthes about the realities of the Level Above Human.

So what happens at veedovou. Some students continue to smoke pot and have sex thus Ti and Do call us together and say, it’s time to get down to business. If you want those things this is not the place for you. A few drop away. Then each student is vetted by some assigned by Ti and Do to interview each student in their camp( as we were spread out so not to draw too much attention, into about 6-7 camps (not sure) with Ti and Do’s camp seperate as well, though they had a small contingent of helpers with them in their camp. When winter started to approach they decided we’d move south and it was snowing the day we left and we headed to Utah, near salt lake city. This was around november of 76. No sooner than we got to our second camping area in the Utah mountains that was very, very cold and snowy, do we find out that they had given instruction for some to go to one camp and another group to a different camping area. (There was always lots of shufflening of students among the camps before then). So Ti and Do came to the camp I was in, where there were about 70 members and told us that we’d made the “cut”. They said that 19 of our fellow students, they didn’t think were up to the task before us so they decided to seperate them into another camp. Within a week we moved from there heading further south and day by day someone would leave in the middle of the night. We didn’t know what happend with this smaller group until months later when we were told that Ti and Do still had occasional contact but had instructed them to locate near a large town and seek to get jobs and that if they continued their overcoming, they would be taken care of by the Next Level. (That group was attended for years by Ti and Do as it’s numbers dwindled and some got apartments. As it turned out one of those members during a period of time when they had no contact with anyone from the larger body for as much as a year he went out looking for Ti and Do. His name becames Drrody, Allan S. and he just happened to bump into Nrrody – Susan P. who was working in a hospital in Amarillo, Texas where we were living in trailors and then in a house and this was in about 1983. When he found us he was elated and he said he knew of another of the 19 that still wanted to find the classroom named Stlody – Steel. They both joined us and were among the 38 in rancho sante fe).

I will continue this description of the vetting progam as it by no means ended there.

Ferg William wrote:

seeing humans as animals in the big picture or whole scheme of things its like these people were there no matter how you look at it this group of 13 or however many, they castrated themselves (some of them) and commited suicide under the impression the halle bop commit would pick them up…. right? so there existence is a part of history, if we are just animals with instinct to survive and procreate why did this happen? animals dont intentionally try to take their own lives, i have never met a human to go to the lengths to have pure bodies and minds as what it seems ti and do did… i read some of the comments people make its like they are so close minded ti had to believe in what he did otherwise he wouldn’t have had the guts to go through with it… he had to have self control in order to remain selfless..the way they went about it, with wrist bands and the away team on their clothes, i feel like this is natures way of saying we are falling into sin (the rest of us) its like these people didnt want to be here on earth, only to serve the purpose of vetting or whatever you call it… they’re bodies frighting the police that came in finally to see them all laying there same clothes kicks and bags over their heads their clothes saying (im going away!) …gave them the impression that this commit would draw their souls up…what scientific proof or reasons did they have for believing this? ? . were these people already evacuated from the human vehicle? were there minds already in heaven as they lived their lives here on earth…

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote:

First off, the term vetting perhaps means something different that the way I was intending it’s use. To me it means being “selective” but that’s not based on a whim or personal like or dislike or personal agenda as would be the case for a human to do it. The reason was because these souls absolutely needed to be as close as was possible to “viable” as Ti and Do said. If they were not close to viable then they needed further lesson ground, which at that point, for those that stayed in the class to the exit, probably means being given a temporary vehicle again but more in their environment, perhaps on board a spacecraft that could be tasked to Observe human activities and/or deliver messages or act as an envoy to humans (what angles and watchers are = task assignments). If they were not viable it also means they will still need to have mammalian styled vehicles. It seems to our history this is what happened in the past resulting for some a decision to depart the Next Level’s service and reinstitute relationships with the humans that had never been in a direct Next Level classroom under an Older Members teachings.

But Ferg for the record there were 38 students that layed down their lives at first and 3 that followed within a year afterwards, all of whom I personally knew, though to varying degrees.

I forgot the number that castrated themselves but it was less than 10 I know and they were all males (something that had been considered but seemed inappropriate given the difficulty and danger to the vehicle involved. Note the Book of John where jesus is quoted as saying, “there are some eunuchs that are born eunuchs, some made eunuchs by men and some who make themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of Heaven’s sake”. It was the same for virtually any part of the body and even for their very life of the body. The physcial body is to put it plainly despensible WHEN and ONLY When one is WITH what they feel is their Older Member (Father) AND are doing so of their own free will (otherwise wouldn’t all the students or male students have it done) AND have convinced the Older Member that they were operating on their own free will AND most of all that the physically present Older Member feels his unseen at that time Older Member is giving the instruction that makes it permissible for students to consider, AND equally most of all from the students perspective that their motivation was NOT self-ish.

This is the crux of the reason I was NOT allowed to be castrated. I wasn’t doing it for Do, my Older Member. I did not love him enough to be allowed to proceed. I was doing it competitively and I can prove that by many of my actions in the years leading up to the day that srrody my partner and I were called to Do (and his 2 helpers Jnnody and Lvvody’s) quarters to proceed to have the castration done by Lvvody, what had been a consideration for at least 2 years hence.

It’s taken me even until right now to realize this. When it said, “make themselves eunuchs FOR THE KINGDOM OF HEAVENS SAKE”, I thought that meant “for the sake of becoming a member of the kingdom of Heaven” which is in line with the idea that we “earn” our gift. That was always my mindset, that I was attempting to prove to Do I wanted to go all the way. Now that’s not entirely a bad thing, it’s just not a viable to survive birth mindset. As bad as it sounds from a human perspective that thinks we should all only believe in ourselves and not give over our will to another, it’s insane, but from the Next Level’s perspective if we are not willing to give our ALL, lock stock and barrell we are not ready and able and therefore worthwhile to have join them as a next level member because until we get to that kind of “child” trust we are not trustworthy and they take their tasks in working a garden and helping to grow souls very, very seriously and have zero interest in anyone mucking it up in any way shape or form so they make it harder and harder to gain access to their ranks. Sure it looks to a human very dictatorial but here is the clincher,their WAYS, what we called the “ways of space” (deep space where only they can go, not permitting space aliens to travel except to the areas they allow), are where all our positive and more civilized and more just and more giving and higher standards and ways of working cooperatively come from. A human being without their guidence throughout history would not advance much further in behavior than most any animal species. They will advance technologically somewhat on their own (though in indirect ways even that is originally stimulated by the Next level, but through space aliens they allow to be around us and through various interface’s of thought).

After lvvody did the castration to surrody with jnnody as lvvodys nurse assistant, handing her surgical tools (as they had it all as Lvvody had been schooled as a nurse before joining the classroom and had her degree and during the classroom period had nursing jobs and the last one she had was working for an Orchiectomist for a year, assiting the surgeon in many orchiectomys – the removal of the testicles. I stood opposite Lvvody. Srrody and I had flipped a coin to see who would go first fullying expecting to have us both castrated. Do asked me before I flipped the coin if I had any reservations in doing this? I said, “well, my vehicle is not looking forward to it but I am overriding my vehicle” which Do said nothing to. Then during the beginning of the operation with Do present as well but no one else (and absolutely no one else in the class knew that this was taking place), Do said, “if this doesn’t bond us nothing will”. Then when srrody’s sack was stitched up with vent tubes inserted for drainage of fluids, something was wrong or seemed wrong to lvvody as Srrody’s vehicles sack gradually inflated like a small balloon and srrody was experiencing some pain from it. (srrody only received local anesthetics for pain – injected right into the testicular sack). Because of this unexpected complication that Lvvody’s experience did not know how to address (as she didn’t know what she had not experienced with her surgeon employer), Do was very disturbed and began to question whether he had stepped beyond Ti’s instruction and guidelines (that at that point was represented from what he clearly felt was a distant relationship with Ti who had left her body years earlier, thus was an “in spirit connection” he was seeking to be a link to us for. He said at that point, “Turn me into the police – I’ve crossed the line here”. At this point I almost in unisin with jnnody and lvvody said, “no way – we will fix this” and we three proceeded to form a plan. Do went to his quarters and we three then proceeded. We took srrody to a motel where I made some calls to clergy to see if anyone knew of anyone who had tried to be castrated. We made up a story about where we were and what had happened to not alarm authorities and find ourselves apprehended, saying our friend had been castrated in Mexico and we just learned of it and he was experiencing a problem. (It was interesting that before the castration surgury Do had us put up a sign over the room that was set up as a sterile operating room. This was in San Clemente, California. We were living inside a huge brand new warehouse in our trailors as strange as that sounds. Anyway, my phone calls were dead ends so we decided we couldn’t wait. Srrody wasn’t feeling better and lvvody’s attempts to clear the vent tubes did not resolve the problem, so we agreed I would take him to a hospital. We decided I could go alone with srrody as then if police got involved jnnody and lvvody would not become involved and it would not as easily get back to Do and become a disruption of the entire classroom undercover project. So I checked srrody in and stayed with him for some hours then returned to the hotel and went back the next morning and he was fine. It was a routine fix and when I came in he was sitting up and the nurses were in love with him and no one even asked me any questions. It was strange actually looking back. We were billed and no authorities ever gotinvolved at all. (I wonder if Ti saw to that). Oh, before we took srrody away from Do’s warehouse quarters Do asked us to contact lggody and jwnody and brief them. They were often Do’s closest helpers moreorless equal to lvvody and jnnody (who by the way were in female vehicles, as was jwnody). Srrody was released the next day and was happy as a lark and Do told me not to mention this to any other classmates until he get’s instruction to do so from Ti and then he also told me, proceeding with the operation for me was “on hold” as well, which I recall affecting me some in the direction of disappointment.

Now regarding HaleBopp. I was still in the class in 1993 when first were aware of astronomers watching an object beyond the pluto orbit that at some point was reported to have changed speed and at another course. All along we were expecting Ti”s crew. We did all sorts of things to see if Ti’s arrival and the end to our task needed to be stimulated by our readiness and that included our location on the planet and state of mind/readiness and qualificatiions/desire and availability – whether being in or close to a metropolitan area or in the moutains or desert mattered. Do had us investigate going to Australia and Haifa, Israel and Germany (iwhere they did end up setting up a mirrored Heaven’s Gate site, in case their actions caused the US based one to be taken down). Nieither Ti nor Do assumed anything. They sought to cover every angle and they did so amazingly cautiously and methodically which included what to express to us and what to check out without us which went into every detail of our physical and mental lives. They didn’t know for instance how long it would be and it took years to decide the option of taking our exit in our own hands. By our it was mostly the inner core of students of which I was often a part, but as this and that were ruled out (though Do certainly didn’t share everythng with even the so called inner core I speak of. I’m sure he spoke to lvvody and jnnody and others about things that he may or may not have felt to bring up to what I’m calling the inner core or “com center” or “satelitte 3”, the “overseers”.

And we’d attempted to leave by our own hand before that but Do called it off, even though every student at that time in 1993 didn’t realize what was happening when we began to fast on air, that after day one turned to water for two weeks in the desert just southeast of Phoenix, AZ. I consciously was prepared to fast until my body expired. But as I learned from Andody (who left the class shortly after the fast, a year before me, whom I am in regular contact with now) he didn’t think it was a possible exit point. But I recall Do saying, I thought in a group meeting that we were moving into the desert  to live and to fast to see if Ti will either come get us there or to expire our vehicles if Ti did not pick us up. Hearing this from andody really woke me up to how different we each were to what we absorbed and didn’t even after 18 or 19 years a dedicated as best we could member. I thought from day one that I would lose my life preaching the message while andody didn’t have that sense.

But that object we’d been watching by proxy, was hardly in the news much so we thought perhaps we needed to stimulate the oppostion to do us in. This thought became more prevlent to consider in witness to the David Koresh Branch Davidian massecur. I happened to be with srrody, my most frequent partner in Do’s quarters with lvvody and jwnody and lggody and jwnody when they lit the place on fire. Do as we all were shocked and appauled. I remember Do saying that he’s got to hand it the David Koresh followers – that they were willing to put it all on the line for what they believed, and I believe he wondered if our group members would do so. It wasn’t long after that that Do suggested in a meeting with the group that we purchase guns in case Ti might have us pose a threat to the government to do us in that way too. I can recall my vehicle bucking the idea of guns and I remember thinking, “what if Do asked me to kill someone” and a part of me thought he would never ask that of us and another part felt like that would be too much and another part thought, perhaps I might. This was all in my head and I put it aside. “more vetting to suggest such a thing?” Was that in a sense like Abraham being instructed to take his son’s life and then being stopped from doing so. I know some that think that must be some insane god to instuct such a thing, but then The Lord didn’t allow him to, so what does that look like – it’s a test of faith.  And sure the Luciferians play on that and influence humans to kill and say a voice told them to do it and no doubt they did hear a voice just like Paul of tarsus heard a voice. It is for this reason that we NEED a face to face Older Member who won’t abuse us in any way shape or form whether we know it or not but will put us to various tests, some on purpose and some by just following his instructins that never came as a voice in one’s head.

But what Do said about hale bopp, as posted on they didn’t know whether or not there really was a spacecraft in the hale bopp comets tail. It was the “marker”,which is another word for “sign from/in the heavens” as Jesus said we should expect. Do felt Kohotek was also a sign in the beginning of their task in 1973.

If you all read Rio’s book,they also experienced seeing beings in their house (what we called a simulated “craft”) attending to certain classmates. A number of classmates witnessed this on the same night and some just recalled it as if it was a dream, Rio being one of these. This wasn’t the first time some saw beings in that way but this was the biggest and the most widespread event of this kind. By the way Ti and Do had many so called UFO encounters but none as real as a nuts and bolt space craft and some were in their dreams. But they didn’t receive instructions in dreams, just certain insights. Instruction came by having ideas and they knew they could not trust those ideas (or their brains interpretation of the ideas until they found colloborative events and circumstances in real life, though students communications to them or news or other thoughts and ideas and observations in general, often over lengthy time periods and then when they decided to move on any one idea, they did so by taking only tiny steps and then stopping and checking “is this the best choice”. Frequently they found what to do from what they realized they should NOT do. That’s why Do stopped the desert water fast after 14 days and we went down to Yuma and then on to california again and prepared the beyond human series for a new public (second) mission that at first Do thought we might do from our secluded crafts. Then he wondered if we should send a few students out. Jwnody and I were chosen for this task and we created a video and tried to get a major Christian Satelitte TV network to upload it, but they turned it down and then Do said that jwnody and I would go out alone which was a short lived idea, which really put me to the test again as I’d been though many tests, as my vehicle was infatuated with Jwnody’s mind and body though I sought to stifle such thoughts and feelings and hide them, though I was deceitful in that regard as I hired Jwnody to be my helper when I became the pastry chef a the five star Bradford Hotel in Austin Texas and I’d find myself looking down her shirt when we worked side by side almost uncontrollably.

I also tried to be castrated a year earlier than the time when Do called Srrody and I to have it done, as I just explained. I was going to go to Mexico.We were living/working in Albuquerque and it’s a long story but I had this sense that srrody was going to ask Do to proceed with getting castrated and I had the strong sense while I was at my programming job that I better act fast so srrody doesn’t beat me to the punch as srrody was always beating people to the punch, so yes this was a type of competition that was purely stimulated by students selves though Ti and Do did expect showing our “love” by beign johnny on the spot and such, which srrody was perhaps the best at, even to a pestering degree Do expressed to the group on more than one occasion, so he had to restain himself in this regard while others needed to take his example to heart more and light a fire under themselves to not be so slow or casual or afraid of looking like a goody two shoes all of which I certainly dealt with feeling. I was getting paid that day so I called the craft and asked those manning the communications center if I could speak with Do and they put me through. This was not normal to do. I had never done that before or anything of that sort except in one other similar circumstance to try to protect Ti and Do from being discovered by the public. So Do came on the phone and I told him I needed to leave the class. This was about 1991-2 before the desert fast. He said, “why?” I said, I didn’t want to say. He said, “is it about what we’d been talking about?” (The entire subject of castration was instigated by Do one day when he gathered just the male students and told them that he had had a nocternal emmission but was unaware of his stimulating it nor was it linked with a sensual dream, but because of that he was examining having a castration procedure done on himself and he descibed the procedure and over the course of the next week spoke with individuals about in though notes and in some cases in person to person. In fact, one day, 12 students were called to his “craft” when he had a seperate craft in Cole Creek canyon, Colorado, just west of Denver and we students had a craft in Littleton, Colorado. When we got there, for me considering myself “one of the 12” so to speak (an ego kind of thought) though it did include lvvody, jnnody who were already there, lggody, jwnody,chkody, rthody,srrody,hvvody,srfody,mrcody and two others I don’t recall right now, Do told us of his castration plans for himself and asked each of us if we would have reservations about such a procedure for ourselves. Hvvody said he did and was nearly in tears over it. I was later partnered with hvvody when hvvody decided to leave the class over that and I am in regular contact with him now.

So Do asked me what my plan was. I said, I’m going to go to Mexico with my paycheck and figure out how to find someone to do it. Then he asked me to wait until he had a chance to talk to me, so he arranged for classmates to come pick me up from work and I went back to the craft and sat with Do who then told me that just this morning two other students approached him expressing they too wanted to proceed with getting the operation and that he was still checking with Ti to see if this was appropriate to allow the students to do. He was most concerned whether such a castation would diminish the challenge some of us needed to have a formitable opposing challenge of staying on the straight and narrow by having to work agaisnt the huge booger that sexualty provides. From the beginning it was known that we’d picked the packages we had,that is with the Next Level’s help to provide the degree of challenge befitting the needed building of what Ti called our mind’s muscle. He wonderedi if taking away that force, largely the main testosterone producer in the body would make it easier and thus prolong or derails the maximum opportunity we each needed to become a viable spirit birth.

Keeping that energy in and redirecting it does build one’s soul body force. But if done for “self” it adds to one’s ego as they become aware of more and feel more of that force and even see results in different ways within the human kingdom – more successes in certain pursuits, more magnetism, etc. Thus the reason we NEED a physically present older member to give all that energy to the service of, to please them, to attempt to be like them in everyway. By give, it’s a distortion to think we give it to antoher by having sex wtih them in thought or deed. That acutally wastes that energy and builds a habit of giving it away though for humans it does seem to keep the vehilce more viral and even phyiscally healthy to be the best reproducing machine possible but for those seeking to transcend the human condition it’s then one more thing to not waste.

I hope it is becoming so, so evident that this Do was far,far from an insane evil minded controlling egotist. I don’t have to convince anyone of that. I just need to tell the truth about what happened inch by inch and then it’s up to each who sees it to be prepared to accept that he was far, far from what he’s been portrayed as.

And I still have not told you many many other things.

But Ferg the reason this happened is because we are NOT just animals with instinct to survive and procreate. We would be had the Next Level not provided another option. Had they not given us a piece of their literal mind that is essentialy accomplished by their sending their membership into our envioronment and showing us they exist and providing opportunities for us to come to know them and even how to make the transition out of the human limited condition, then we would still be only thinking about survival and procreation and survival would morpf into greed and even thinking of ourselves as creator gods as we see in much of the new age spiriutal movements.

Flesh and bone did not reveal this to you, that animals will never, ever give their lives for any other animal with one exception I am aware of. They will attempt to fight to the death to protect their young. But some will fight a bit but if they think the fight will be too big they will run away and let their young be eaten. And of course animals will at some point say good bye to their young and say you are on your own while some will even consume some of their young when they instinctually seem to think some will not be able to survive.

Humans are moreorless made of the same genetic flesh and thus the same genetic programming,that is until the next level implants some vehicles with implanted souls and/or their information – by spreading their truth and some believe it and by doing so open up a channel either to an existing soul still in our environment or to be given a soul. There are different types of souls given too and of course different degrees of what each soul does with their opportunity from ignoring what it’s set of soul programs stimulate – namely continuous seeking to diverting it into some religious oranti religious but still very limited pseudo awakening mostly in word alone.

This is why each who begins to graft to the next level’s vine need to “stand up” for the information -not keep their “light” received under the bushel basket and be prepared for the ramificaions that will often cause the vehicle to lose it’s life. But if we hold it in to instead try to save our life in this world then we lose our opportunity to obtain the more real life the information promises, however as long as we are still in a vehicle we can “repent” – Change our mind and receive remission of all past “sins” (missing the mark) freed from our Karma BUT that’s a day by day condition. There is no once saved always saved. There is no remission of sins forever when we are not continually striving to increase the degree in which we seek to give to the Next Level’s service.

Ti occupied female vehicle but do does tend to use the word “he” to describe members of the Next Level.

Yes and when the authorities entered that house they knew this was very out of the ordinary. They said it didn’t feel like the many crime scenes they’d attended before. They were shocked and in awe just like in revellations 11 and what did they do in the eyes of the world, at least what impression did they leave…that they believed they were ascending though or into heaven’s gate agains just like in rev 11 and in the media’s eyes and all those who realized they had made a huge spash before,in 1975-6 internationally they were “standing up again” (resurrection from the dead(the normal human condition of eventually perishing after spending some time in the spirit world, that is until it’s recycle time, that for some spirits is extended by the Next Level’s choosing to contain certain discarnates and space aliens so at the approrpriate time they can once again be allowed to influences humans who are new soul implants, to give them a challenging job of ovecoming towards their own viablity and thus next level membership.

Scientific proof to believe this? Well that’s hard to see but yet it’s easy to see. The science comes in the willingness to proceed a step at a time towards belief, testing it all the way, not doing anything we feel uncomfortable about in the least and recognizing when someone or something is seeking to compromise our deepest sense of what is right and good. It becomes a type of “common sense” and intuition is developed. WE can always choose to use that intuition for profit and gain popularity for it or we can realize that there is frankly obviously more than meets our eyes so why not seek from the highest source we can imagine, even willing to trust someone on the basis of what we can’t deny seems to be “beyond human”.

jesus taught us to be above human, above because of it’s selflessness and we can see that if we were all selfless this world would be a utopia. And the buddha’s taught that too, though of course their teachings have been nearly lost, at least to most who use them as figureheads alone.

yes and no regarding their minds already being in heaven. Heaven in one sense is where your heart is.In that way they were all in heaven but it’s also in degrees and the option always exists to leave that graft, though once one has a next level body , it is no longer equipt with the reproductive plumbing so is incorruptible as it says in various places in the bible anther of the few places paul seemed to get it right.

Graz wrote:

so ferg, if what u are saying is correct, why did evolution make sexual interaction so enjoyable?

i kind of agree in some ways that sexuality can be negative to the human soul, but only if that soul is thinking about it all the time and not engaging in it.

but i just cant see how something that is natural can be looked at as being sinful. ok, its also valid to believe it should only be apart of our thoughts when we reproduce, but then nature didnt create us in the same light as most other animals so i believe nature intended and wanted us to engage in sexual activity for pleasure.

and nature dont lie or come up with bullshit. its pure truth because it is pure in its elements, unperverted by humanity.

Sawyer HeavensGatge wrote:

What’s so different between humans and animals anyway? Do you know that if a part of the brain is disconnected or disabled you could still talk fine and be completly understood by others but would not be able to distinguish all the majorand minor nuances to speech and sound as much, even so little that while others hear it as normal speech you would hear your own speech as a person with a severe talking abnormality to where it really does sound like a dog barking?

Another huge point to this conversation is “where did nature come from”

If we didn’t create nature then how can we know nature intended us to have sex for fun, all because it feels good. To some people it doesn’t feel so good acutally. It also feels good to inject heroin so does that mean we were intended to do it. For some it feels good to hurt another. Feeling good is trivial to thrive on. Sure it’s an option but it is a dead end option and sure we all probably do something because it feels good – eating ice cream is a popular one but believe it or not, if eating ice cream was a goal to not allow control over us, as I’d bet it does tend to controll some,then IF a choice is made to not have anything in control over the greater part of ourselves – our soul evolution then if one was determined to lick (pun intended) the chosen problem and slipped and ate some when they wished they hadn’t, then they would be “sinning”.

For those that want to purify themselves as much as possible to be found worthy to enter the Level above Human, all things human and animal like will have to be under controll and especially sexuality as because of it’s nature, has a great deal of power over us and energy expenditure mentally and physically to redirect into learning more important lessons.

Ferg Wrote:

interesting story and well put… where to start… do you know what food or drink they ingested to kill themselves? we are no different from animals. we are conscious of our existence and are evolved from simple thinking creatures, when an animal gets caught in a trap, it will chew its arm off to escape. so humans procreate simply to continue the species, which will eventually die, continuing the circle of life and death… Graz Mataz i think we are the same as animals, and sex is continuing life, which sucks occasionally, so i can see it as a bad thing…

Sawyer HeavensGate wrote:

Good points on the animals even willing to lose a limb to survive overall – goes right to what Jesus said, if your eye offends you it would be better to pluck it out and live with one less eye than to lose your chance to enter the Kingdom of heaven and the same example with a hand and the same example with one’s sexuality even to the physical degree of castration, which by the way some essenes (considered a radical jewish sect that seemed equally aligned with Enoch and Moses teachings). Where people freak out at these ideas of sacrifice of even a part of the body is being unable to fathom Jesus really meaning that but it was far from the only examples of how Jesus thought of the body as eventually all aspiring members to the Kingdom of Heaven must “die in christ” in other words lose their life while in belief of and in practice of the teachings which will result at one time or another with death at the hands of a human that for whatever reason finds their talk and influence on others a crime punishable by death. If we try to save our life, by hiding what we know then we stand to lose our potential greater life in the hereafter eventually. The next level doesn’t give up on their students easily. They get many chances but to take that for granted is a distortion that religion justify by the premise that if you belong to such and such an organization that claims to be connected then as long as you live by a certain moral code, you will be found to be in good stead with.

Even still Jesus did NOT say we MUST lose our eye or hand or testiciles (when we lack control over those parts that continuously compromise our staying on the straight and narrow “overcoming” process. He said it would be “better” to lose them than lose our opportunity to graduate into his kingdom as eventually all our bodies die and are lost anyway. However this can be distorted into thinking by doing something to our body we are earning the reward, like flogging self or piercing one’s hands and feet and carrying a cross or tempting the lord by playing around with venomous snakes and drinking poisons on a misinterpreation of what Jesus was quoted to say.

For instance Do said to the males that were having problems with sensuality that they could come up with whatever they wanted to try to get control over that urge, but he wouldn’t give us examples. We already talked about castration and while our older member is with us, to decide to say…castrate oneself as the Essenes were reported to be doing – smashing their testicles with big rocks-wow that does a number on my head, would be inappropriate to do withoiut checking with that present Older Member first, though that can be a fine line of when to take strong initiatives). However the reason for checking in that circumstance would have to do more with the ramifications of such an action. For instance what was most important to Ti and Do, but the entire project of preparing the students for their graduation which entailed helping them decide if this was truely what they wanted and pressing forward to accomplish it in a timely way. Tothis end anything that might interfer, threaten stopping the task or threatening any of it’s participants voluntary continuation in the program (like by investigators and cult deprogrammers that we did have documented proof were looking for us for years, sent by various member’s vehicular families) was of the utmost priority concern. Thus should a student take an action that might put that security in jeorpardy, they would certainly be up in arms about it. Say someone severed their own testicles off for instance and it got infected or didn’t heal and we couldn’t stop the bleeding and they had to be taken to a hospital or say they died in Ti and Do’s care, all by their own choice to be a zealot for god so to speak, that would be not only a concern for that individual but moreso since it was their choice however seemed to be stimulated by the teachings it could easily lead to police involvment and a complete disruption of an otherwise very delicate and controlled accellerated overcoming classroom, then jeopardizing the students from what they too were working towards. Sure the Next Level could have done something to “fix it” but that’s not the way the Next level generally works. Sure they can recoop and always let nature takes it’s course, postponing the graduation, saving the nearly viable souls for a new opportunity but we don’t  know just how delicate nearly viable souls are. A prize flower can always be killed and may or may not survive and bloom.  And I saw some of these concerns right up front.

One student, called brnody, a female in her late 30’s when she joined from an Oklahoma City meeting, a few years into joining with us started to have detiorating health manifest as what seemed to be a resurgence in a childhood type of polio. She at first needed crutches and then was in a wheel chair diagnosed by docters, as when Ti (who was an accomplished nurse before she and Do awakened to their task) didn’t know what to do for her, had her see, called osteoperosis, years later really started going downhill and Do was concerned that she could literally “die” in our care. I was an overseer and was working very close with Do on many projects by then. His first concern at that time was the classroom’s continuence. He had already by then tried to do many, many things for brnody’s health so there was no neglect of her. For instance she had all sorts of medications, we’d tried all sorts of healthy diets – fasting, herb and homenopathics, vitamins, raw food programs – not only for her but for other’s ailments. She and I had colonic irrigations, we had exercise programs forher. Myself and others were on a schedule of regular massaging of highly inflamed leg joints. We had six of us (me included trying to “lay hands” on her. She had countless doctors visits and nothing was working and I can talk to this in terms of discanated influences – because some physical ailments are amplified or even partially caused by discarnates that died with similar or even specific ailments when they died thus if they hang around us and we take in some of their “mind”(programming) that includes their ways, we then accept their entire package that includes their encoded memory of whatever physical problems their vehicle had before their death. Ti had addressed this with brnody, that she was being permissive to influences. In particular brnody’s biggest booger so to speak, what kept her from overcoming but which was also her biggest ticket to a viable birth was in the form of “control”. She sought to have control over everything in her life and in the world was very good at it, was a manager of others in various workplaces I beleive. But in the class, we were learning to relinguish such control, giving over that control to the Kingdom of God(next level) through their present reps Ti and Do, which meant brnody’s learning to give walking papers to whatever discarnates were with her that were beneficial while in the world but were now something to get rid of. So she was very, very stubborn while one of our biggest lessons was to become very,very flexible. So what did the vehicle and it’s influences do – they got stronger, permitted by the Next level who actually assigned us certain influences to be like our mind exercise machines to help us rise to the occasion of boxing them out of the ring. Brndoy would have periods of time of certain success but then would like all of us backslide in our mental and physical disciplines and it becamse clear to Do that she was not thriving in the overall classroom experiential overcoming process so he assigned her a different task. We set up an apartment in Dallas, Texas (where we often lived)  and she was given that space to live in while Do and his helpers (lvvody and jnnody) worked with her needs. She got a job working for the folks that put on the tv show “Dallas” and she began to thive on her own as the classroom was a hothouse indeed, so was just too much for her. She needed a different circumstance. And as it turned out so did others, each for their own reasons. Thus about 6-8 students at varying times spent time in Dallas in 1-3 apartments in Dallas not knowing the whereabouts of the larger body of students or teacher(as Ti had exited her vehicle by then). She ended up still being crippled but she was able to function almost on her own, though with certain help from the state that she applied for – a device to take her wheel chair with her car and a way to use the gas and brake pedals with her hands, which also gave her some problems by then. I know about all this because I was one assigned to visit
her.Actually Jwnody and I becames overseers, in additin to some others to keep up with her and other’s circumstances and needs. But these were not monitored by the classroom. If they wanted to go back into human ways they were free to. For instance Tllody, who got his name because he was 6′ 6″ tall ended up getting a sports car and even a girlfriend. And I could tell stories about anyody and sngody and stlody and cddody (the only one that didn’t later rejoin the class and lay down his life with the others).

So what kind of cult leader would let that happen? This was the most extraordinary experience and mind boggling reality that had ever taken place on the planet, at least within our history books.

But to the point, Do was concerned that she might die in our keeping and it could bring an investigation onto him which would disrupt the final stage of classroom which at that time he didn’t know would encompass as this was all before I left in late 1994,though these in that “satelitte craft” did rejoin as a result of our 2nd public offerring in 1994, starting 1/1/94 when we’d broken all our leases and sold all the furniture of three homes to outfit ourselves forthe road, in vans with some camping gear and satelitte phones and such into 4 groups of 6 members each, that included going to Dallas (my group) and offerring the sateliite to rejoin the larger body as it was never assumed that they would, but they did.

So like animals, even the soul will do extraordiary things to survive which includes “laying down it’s physical wrapper” when the Older Members say’s it’s time for him to do so as well as for anyone who wanted to go with them.