informal talk of Jesus seeker illusions and Christian Anti-Christ

Gary says to sawyer:

I do agree you have offered me great insight to what the class and TI and DO taught, and that is something I never thought would have happened, though I never knew anything about TI until I made contact with you. As for the answer to your question as to what I love about TI and DO. I love them for who they were, kind, gentle people. I know love is more than a feeling, it is an action.Never having met them or the others, I can only go by what I have seen in the videos, and I do realize that is maybe not enough. I know Jesus loved those He never met, and I want to help people see that kind of love even for those I never knew. Something else too, when you told me I seemed to be praising you when we talked or in my emails, in my heart I am not praising you, I see it as encouraging you as I do with most people I care about.I no more want praise from others either, but I do welcome encouraging words. I do not tell one of our associates or my wife they are capeable of doing a task, or improving a situation to praise them, I do it for encouragement and to give them a boost of confidence. Kinda like a child, if the parents do not give them positive and encouraging words the child will not grow up with confidence and srive to do better at what it is he or she is capeable of, garbage in, garbage out concept.
I do not praise any man other than Christ. Humans are faliable, Christ was not. I try to treat people equaly, not indifferently, though I fail at it a lot of times, I continue to try. So let me know you thoughts on this. Peace to you always.

Sawyer Heavensgate:

Hi Gary – I know I’ve been directly critical of much of what you’ve said, both about Jesus, Ti and Do and others – that doesn’t come easy to me as my vehicles personality stives to be liked by everyone, but if I am to continue offerring what Ti and Do, through my experiences with them have offerred me then I must continue for whatever it’s worth, … that is when I hear and see things that strike me as potentially benefiting from correction, which actually is everything to include all that I think, say and do. By correction what I am meaning is simply improvment which always involves a type of course correction/change, not a self righteous Lording over that is so common among humans in every walk. Yes, I too have influences that can try to get me to fill myself with myself but when we have been taught to at least be open to such, and we continuously have a mindset of wanting to do better-receive correction from whatever instrument may deliver it, then it’s all “good”. It’s when we close ourselves off to course correction that we sink more and more into one or another form of entrenchment and stagnation (though we may still talk the talk of growth and change).

When you say Jesus was perfect, I know you don’t KNOW the real Jesus. Go see what he said about that. When you say you love Jesus, go see what he said the criteria was that would demonstrate “love”. Look at what he said about “prasing with mouth while heart is far from me”, a form of washing the outside of the cup “saying things that sound wonderful and positive while not willing to change because of how it upsets our apple cart. Repent meant “change you mind” literally. That means “think differently”. You are clinging to either the retorick you’ve been programmed to accept or are engaged in a game. Anybody can be “nice” and “kind”. Look at what Jesus said about that. “even the evil love their own and want good things for their own”, and yes one can still refrain from thinking we can “judge/measure” those that we see that participate in very predatory and harmful to life and life choice behaviors – why – because as jesus said, the “sun is also shining for them” in other words they too are part of the overall creation – gifted with life by no effort of their own (though it does take effort to survive and live), but none of the elements and systems and choices were provided by humans, except indirectly by use of all the elements. You said jesus loves even those he doesn’t know. Well for one which “love” word was he most likly using and what degree of love is he talking about. It’s easy to say that because everyone is programmed with that. If that wasn’t put out then one of the major aspects that draw people to religions would vanish. The prime way he does “love” all in his Father’s admiraling of the creation is by giving us all an equal chance to become all we want to become, whether that is. In other words, giving us a degree of free will is the extention of love and then giving of his efforts to help potentially all is yet another extenstion BUT if we refuse to accept that offerring by ignoring it or misusing it and ultimatelly steering others away from it (done in indirect ways that look the part) then, after so many opportunities to change his “love” becomes seeing to it that the waste (those that care nothing for anything but themselves and their own) and have no longer any sense of reality any more, thinking of themselves in one way or another as having “found” their truth and ceasing to look further and “change their minds” to the tune of influencing others to be like themselves, then he is showing his love for those that still have a chance by recycling those that have become weeds and then he’s not really showing love for the weeds is he? So this idea that he loves everything is balony and I can back that up with many scriptures.

If and when you become and/or continue to be a more ardent seeker of the highest truthes (which are not the mystical esoteric hokus pokus “spiritual” generalities and supernatural emphasized religiosities, things we’re told are those truthes, which I understand is a difficult process that we all must be engaged, and can be fooled by and thus must press through to get the kernals of reality), you will come back with the substansive details of what Jesus was about, rather than the christian hollywood styled anti-Jesus reality expressions. I have tried to share many of those with you, through the review I began to write for your book that you moreorless ignored as it would have been too much effort to postpone it’s publication, I suppose, to make improvements in the areas I suggested (as it understandably but tragically for your sake (if you continuously ignore what could very well be your greatest chance to learn about the real Jesus)). And I continue to share things with you and you say to me, thank you for the lesson (a term of endearment and a phony one I’m afraid to have to admit) because you don’t really think of me as teaching you anything or you would show more evidence of it, in “changing your mind”(which I absolutely do not WANT you to do to satisfy ME and absolutely do not care to be thought of as a teacher to you (though anyone at anytime can be a teacher to anyone at anytime IF someone is seeking to grow/change/evolve/develop in whatever area). Now, having said that for whatever it’s worth to you, perhaps I am wrong and perhaps you are changing your mind in ways I have yet to see (and of course you owe me nothing in that as I am not your god). But if you want to continue this level of relationship with me, I need to see that at least some of it you are taking to heart by at the very least challenging what I say about Jesus WITH examples of how I may be seeing it or seeing Jesus in a less than accurate light (since we do appear to have a common interest in Jesus, as opposed to the one sided aspect of my talking about Ti and Do whom you have little experience with, understandably). And if you can’t debate me, then research the subject for yourself – look up the greek and hebrew and latin and cultural context as best we can. And most of all. Talk to God the creator about it. Ask to be shown the highest interpretations and go over it over and over and over as time and effort permits and do so with a willingness to “change your mind”. I try to do the same things. It’s ongoing. However, if this means next to nothing to you, then you will simply assume you already have the highest way of looking at it, because of what this or that author or preacher told you – “like that satan is  the instigator of the idea that the Jesus second coming would be in secret”,when I’ve pointed out the numerous things Jesus said that counteract that idea, at least for the phase Jesus was speaking of where he would be “revealing more of what previously were mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven” and would “speak plainly of the kingdom” and that both he and his Father would take up dwelling/residence with us, and that he would come as a “thief in the night” (certainly quite hidden) and could go on and on. I don’t fault you for not knowing how to come back with debate on these and other things but I do fault “holding onto the same old thinking when you’ve received opportunity to change” and that doesn’t mean you must parrott ME as if I am seeking to grow in understanding I am still open to further changes and adjustments which you could easly be stimulated by your questions and comments though doesn’t imply that all understandings will change. I don’t know if this means much to you but I think it could. I know change is tough but the true God team requires it constantly to strive to be on their team – that I am sure of.

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2 Responses to “informal talk of Jesus seeker illusions and Christian Anti-Christ”

  1. Online Shopping Says:

    Your blog is so informative … keep up the good work!!!!

  2. XF Heaven's Gate Says:

    Unlike others, I for one do not praise nor worship Christ. I respect Christ or the mind that was in him but I do not accept as Lord and Savior because he’s not. I’m not saved either. None of us are. To me it is selfish to even think that way. The Next Level decides whether or not we are saved- not us. He came and went and unless others seek out the information of Ti & Do they will labor under a lie. The cross is an execution device not meant to be worshipped because it is a weapon and not a symbol of peace. However Do did say that “Every religion can prepare an individual to prepare for a time when a Next Level Rep comes in.” but that doesn’t mean staying in a false belief system or false doctrine once you have been exposed to correct and current doctrine. I thank God and the Next Level for the Ti & Do revelation. I also thank those who have also assisted as well in some tough times.

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