causual talk about the early days with Ti (Peep) and Do (Bo) in 1975

response to a new believer in Ti and Do wondering why Sawyer was reluctant to take any kind of leadership position with new believers:
Sawyer:
My leader is Do. If Do indicates to me that I need to take more of a leadership role then I’ll rise to that occasion
[6/13/2013 7:40:50 PM] Sawyer: I know my every thought and action are monitored because I have asked to be in their service and need them to help me.
[6/13/2013 7:41:07 PM] Sawyer: I don’t know what it will come to.
[6/13/2013 7:42:37 PM] Sawyer: Some people want me to be their Older Member but I’m not an older Member yet I do have Ti and Do’s mind in me and it’s deep. It’s not at all just information. I’m bonded and yet I’m far from bonded to the degree I need to be.
[6/13/2013 7:43:38 PM] Sawyer: I can understand some looking to me, in a sense in place of Do and that’s to be expected and Do even talked about it referring to new believers hooking up with an “active student”. I am an “active student”.
[6/13/2013 7:44:07 PM] Sawyer: But it’s not my job to lead. It’s my job to get people to ask Do to be their leader.
[6/13/2013 7:44:30 PM] Jon: have other people besides that -other- Sawyer asked you to be thier older member? i could be wrong, but think that only ti and do are our older member-right, right, you and June were in the beyond human video, has that become a burden, or come back to haunt you in any regard?
[6/13/2013 7:46:11 PM] Sawyer: From when I first started to publically interface again around 2003 I have had people treating me as if I was seeking to be this or that big kahuna.
[6/13/2013 7:46:41 PM] Sawyer: Some believe it has to be that way and that I’m silently planning on such.
[6/13/2013 7:47:54 PM] Sawyer: And there are some that suspect I’m seeking to build a new group, new cult. After all isn’t that what all the groups do? Everytime a “teacher” dies, one or more of their students continue on and/or start their own offshoot sect.
[6/13/2013 7:48:52 PM] Jon: we should make in clear in each and every podcast that we are not a new heavens gate, not a new “ufo cult”
[6/13/2013 7:48:58 PM] Sawyer: I have had some want to come to where I live and I have had some threaten, saying I need to be stopped becuse they think I’m restarting a cult.
[6/13/2013 7:51:24 PM] Sawyer: Yes, we can say that but it won’t stop the luciferians from putting the thought in people’s minds and it probably will result in loss of my vehicle, at least that’s what the book of revelations says and that is what is on the line for all believers eventually. The human vehicle is crutial to graduating the human experience. But so is the loss of that vehicle while in service to the Older Member.
[6/13/2013 7:52:44 PM] Sawyer: It’s not a “martyr trip” true. but “flesh and bone doesn’t inherit the kingdom of God/Heaven”. The soul birth is an invisible birth.
[6/13/2013 7:53:17 PM] Jon: “fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul”
[6/13/2013 7:53:25 PM] Sawyer: exactly
[6/13/2013 7:54:34 PM] Jon: and the second time the Rep came around, what was it Do said, “all it costs is your life”?
[6/13/2013 7:55:14 PM] Sawyer: Peter is all excited about doing this and he can be used, his service to bring the info to people who otherwise hear my name or have seen my face wouldn’t give it another thought as I’m that evil cult leader’s lacky to many and to most christians a heratic plain and simple.
[6/13/2013 7:55:28 PM] Sawyer: I’ve been told that on a number of occasions
[6/13/2013 7:55:39 PM] Sawyer: And I’ve been told that face to face also.
[6/13/2013 7:55:54 PM] Jon: yeah-me too, recently
[6/13/2013 7:56:04 PM] Sawyer: I’ve been thrown out of church buildings, not physically but just about.
[6/13/2013 7:56:16 PM] Sawyer: really, what happened to you.
[6/13/2013 7:57:17 PM] Jon: an old frend of mine asked what church i go to, and i told him what i believe about the father and the son, how the tradirional Xtian theology relates to Ti and Do, the real truth, and he said i was going to hell, that i believe a false jesus, etc etc
[6/13/2013 7:57:24 PM] Jon: a heretic
[6/13/2013 7:58:29 PM] Sawyer: that’s right. The lines are being drawn. This information seperates the real sheep from the goats.
[6/13/2013 7:58:52 PM] Jon: he can believe whatever he wants, i cant force him into the truth, it would do no good
[6/13/2013 7:59:03 PM] Sawyer: They will kill in the name of their god as we have seen in history in every religion and that isnt’ going to change now.
[6/13/2013 7:59:25 PM] Jon: you cant “make” people see )-:
[6/13/2013 7:59:54 PM] Sawyer: don’t want to make anyone see!
[6/13/2013 8:00:23 PM] Sawyer: never ever works that way. It’s why, “knock, seek, ask” was the way.
[6/13/2013 8:03:45 PM] Sawyer: when we first got on teh road goign church to church in 1975 there were some who loved going into a church office and telling them that the Two Witnesses were here and they need to see it and accept it, blah, blah, blah. I had verbal arguments with so called fellow believers in ti and do over that. I would follow the instructions ti and do gave us, that these two in particular didn’t get first hand but knew I had, yet were caught up in the whole idea of being on the leading edge of spirituality. One took the name “lightborn” and the other, “john the baptist”. Lightborn in particular always seemed to want to change things to his ideas. We were trying to do a meeting in the boston area and we had rendevoued with another group that traveled east from the west coast (before we all broke up entirely). I remember being in a sports field in a park in the tennis courts having a meeting with maybe 20 followers, though a handful of follower who had met Ti and Do. I did have a leadership role then in the sense that I had the direct commission from Ti and Do and was on fire with doing the task. We still operated on a concensus basis, more or less and most were happy to let jnnody and I with her partner and mine dndody take some lead in decision making yet no matter what we thought about and decided lightborn had a very vocal problem with. I got so frustrated with him that I said to him then, that if he couldn’t work with us, why doesn’t he just leave.
He tried to seperate me from the partner Ti and Do had assigned sayign we were together too long. I refused and then found my self and “dandy” traveling with he and “john the baptist” in lightborns car until the car had a problem and we were broke down on the side of the road in vermont and I just said to dandy, let’s just go, so we walked off and hitched to south texas to escape the winter that was setting in fast.
So my point was that lightborn and john were caught up with the excitment but weren’t really ready to go the distance as surfaced soon thereafter but I don’t know about in detail becasue I never them after that while dandy and I bumped into Ti and Do some 5 months later after my screaming to the heaven’s for help to know what to do next after hearing no new news about them for those 5 months.
This group in the beginning was full of “leaders” but when Ti and Do drew lines in the sand, theorectically as they did so by giving instructions that challenged students to decide if this was what they wanted.
But the instruction we were given by Ti and Do when they sent us out in Twos and threes, with two such partnerships to a car, which new followers could have sought to know, that was shared with them when they first joined but kind of fell by the wayside was to go to the churchs and ask for what you need. If you’re hungry tell them you are hungry and could use some food. If you need gas ask for gas. Never ask for money.
[6/13/2013 8:04:24 PM] Sawyer: Then the preacher would at times ask us how we find ourselves with these needs and we’d say, “we’re doing our heavenly father’s work as we have new information about the real Kingdom Level Above Human, or something to that effect.
[6/13/2013 8:04:58 PM] Sawyer: And if they asked what that informatin was, we’d give them a taste, telling about the two witnesses bo and peep.
[6/13/2013 8:05:46 PM] Sawyer: Sometimes we’d be asked in to have a discussion. Other times they’d hand us a $20 bill and other times send us to the police station to get a voucher, where we might get searched or sometimes nothing at all or a slammed door.
When dandy and I found an open church door when we were hitching everywhere, we’d go in and find cans of beans in the cupboard, we’d use their kitchen to fix them. That is if we didn’t see a residence nearby and we’d sleep on the floor and sometimes would be woken up by the preacher and a conversation would ensue and sometimes we’d be classified the devils children and run out.
[6/13/2013 8:07:15 PM] Sawyer: Some were about to help us until they heard what we believed and then turned away. I did that door to door every day all day for about 6 months in 1975-6
[6/13/2013 8:07:47 PM] Jon: two by two, no purse and scrip?
[6/13/2013 8:08:05 PM] Sawyer: yes, in twos or threes
[6/13/2013 8:08:26 PM] Sawyer: Ti and do assigned everyone a partner and if there was a odd person a threesome.
[6/13/2013 8:09:03 PM] Sawyer: we started out two or three partnershiops to a car or van.
[6/13/2013 8:09:08 PM] Jon: wow, hard work-a very literal inretpretation of spripture, strange that no so called christian missionaries (jw, mormon, etc) work like that
[6/13/2013 8:09:10 PM] Jon: ….
[6/13/2013 8:10:05 PM] Sawyer: we left everything behind. At that time there were all sorts running around doing the same kind of thing.
[6/13/2013 8:10:25 PM] Sawyer: I met jesus freaks who didn’t even wear shoes as they went walkign and hitchhiking around.
[6/13/2013 8:11:54 PM] Sawyer: we were criss crossing the US in the winter and some preachers would pick us up and say, the holy ghost told them to pick us up.
[6/13/2013 8:12:04 PM] Sawyer: and’s we ‘d have great converstaion.
[6/13/2013 8:12:41 PM] Jon: no doubt (-:
[6/13/2013 8:13:07 PM] Sawyer: we’d go in to a town and ask help at a church and if it felt good, would try to set up a meeting in the town.
[6/13/2013 8:13:20 PM] Sawyer: So we’d go to the newpapter and give an interview.
[6/13/2013 8:13:35 PM] Sawyer: Bo and peep was big news so everyone knew of the story so we were a story.
[6/13/2013 8:14:02 PM] Sawyer: IN one newpaper they repported that we were the two.
[6/13/2013 8:14:42 PM] Jon: i could be wrong, but you were considered “lost” for awhile after the waldport meeting, were you not? no one knew what happened
[6/13/2013 8:14:50 PM] Jon: ourside the group
[6/13/2013 8:15:00 PM] Sawyer: and though I thought martrydom was heroic then I thought about whether or not some might want to kill us the way Ti and Do thought they would as the two witnesses be killed.
[6/13/2013 8:15:23 PM] Sawyer: yes, it was mysterious becasue there were no real names to search out.
[6/13/2013 8:16:08 PM] Sawyer: After the meeting I went to in Waldport in 1975, i told the existing followers i wanted to join them and so did my girlfriend. Actually it’s a long stoory but that was “sarah” of mark and sarah.
[6/13/2013 8:16:22 PM] Sawyer: They gave us a phone number to call.
[6/13/2013 8:17:05
PM] Sawyer: They said to tie up our loose ends of our lives, give things away, whatever and call and they would give us a place to come to.
[6/13/2013 8:18:16 PM] Sawyer: sarah’s sister found out that we were joining and freaked out and threatedn to drive her truck off the cliff. She knew also that ron and judy our two best friends were joining also and they had two little children, jen and adam.
[6/13/2013 8:18:55 PM] Sawyer: they had arranged for jen and adam to be with their real dad who lived near portland. we were on the coast maybe 80 or so miles from portland.
[6/13/2013 8:19:24 PM] Sawyer: So the sister seeing that we were still going to join, went to the police and claimed kids were being abandoned.
[6/13/2013 8:19:34 PM] Jon: !!
[6/13/2013 8:19:36 PM] Jon: wow
[6/13/2013 8:19:46 PM] Sawyer: I was leaving ron and judy’s apratment when the sister and the police came to the door.
[6/13/2013 8:20:09 PM] Sawyer: and confronted me with whether children were being left behind – abandoned
[6/13/2013 8:20:26 PM] Sawyer: I denyied it and the sister was furious with us.
[6/13/2013 8:20:36 PM] Sawyer: But the police had nothing to go on so left.
[6/13/2013 8:21:34 PM] Sawyer: then the sister phoned her parents in ny and they immedieally flew out the next day to meet with sarah and I (they knew me well as i’d been with sarah for 5 years starting from when we met when we were 18 and 19
[6/13/2013 8:21:54 PM] Sawyer: though they disliked that I was catholic and she was jewish
[6/13/2013 8:22:15 PM] Sawyer: and I instigated a a hitchiking trip cross country and then shacked up with her in NY after that, again very unpopular, though they still seemed to like me or at least tolerate me as sarah was very independant herself.
[6/13/2013 8:22:40 PM] Sawyer: anyway we were in a motel argueing with her dad, her uncle and her grandmother and sister.
[6/13/2013 8:23:19 PM] Sawyer: Afther that heated meeting sarah would not change what she wanted so I was blamed for influencing her to believe in jesus and all.
[6/13/2013 8:23:39 PM] Sawyer: the next day, we knew that we had better get out of town so we did
[6/13/2013 8:23:56 PM] Sawyer: with ron and judy and two other close friends.
[6/13/2013 8:24:26 PM] Sawyer: This was after I’d gone all over town telling all my hippy friends “I feel I sat in front of the equivilent of jesus”.
[6/13/2013 8:25:37 PM] Jon: mmm about influencing her to believe in jesus-i mean, Ti is YHWH, the father, who jews say is god of abraham, issac, jacob, and moses
Yes, but they didn’t know that or even consider that as they were steeped in religion, the “killer of souls” because of that. jesus even addressed the same thing, how they stole the souls of men.
[6/13/2013 8:25:42 PM] Sawyer: Anyay that indicedent with the two children started the investigation
[6/13/2013 8:26:02 PM] Sawyer: that became the headlines of 27 people leaving after the waldport meeting
[6/13/2013 8:26:07 PM] Jon: mmm
[6/13/2013 8:26:10 PM] Sawyer: to get a ride on a ufo
[6/13/2013 8:26:37 PM] Sawyer: cloud of light. Ti and Do didn’t approve the use of “ufo”. They would have said, “spacecraft” but students didnt’ check with them first.
[6/13/2013 8:27:27 PM] Sawyer: and ti and do wouldn’t have approved of abandoning children either though at that meeting I was talking about, Do said, Children couldn’t come and a lady in the back yelled out loudly, “you ought to be shot”.
[6/13/2013 8:27:28 PM] Jon: sure, of course, they knew it was a next level crafy, thus not “unidentified”
[6/13/2013 8:27:37 PM] Jon: *craft
[6/13/2013 8:28:33 PM] Sawyer: I remember noticing the meeting room had this dense haze hovering over everyone like smoke and aroudn the stage and around ti and do especially it was like shimmering energy more than smoke looking.
[6/13/2013 8:29:10 PM] Sawyer: yes they knew and they didnt’ want to buy into popularist terms like UFO i guess.
[6/13/2013 8:31:02 PM] Sawyer: especially when in the west coast there were all sorts of groups surrounding adamski and david fry and a whole host of contactees, all facsimiiils created by the luciferians tryign to throw a monkey wrench into the plans they knew would be unfolding in the U.S. cause the luciferians know how the Next level generally works.
The instruction for those following Bo and Peep in 1975 that I received from Nora a follower and that we later told others who joined after me, was to bring with us camping gear if we had it, a car if we had one and cash if we had it but that nothing was required. They were living outdoors and traveling with car’s and needed money for gas. I joined with $50.00 and a sleeping bag as did Sarah. I got that from selling some of my instruments as we were basically broke when we joined. Robert, one of my best friends who owned the property where I was homesteadiing with him and another couple, where I was building my teepee house, owned 4-5 houses in Newport he rented out to hippies. He signed them all over to people to include his 3 acre parcel with an A frame on it. He ended up returning less than 6 months later and got his A frame property back. I visited with him in 1995 when I visited with many of the dropouts. Years later there were two classmates that were able to tap into trust funds their parents had set up for them, but for the first nearly 5 years no one had jobs and Ti and Do supplied all our supplies, to nearly 70 people on what people had brought into the group. Thus you were right…there was no stashing away of anything as keeping 70 people fed and traveling with insurance on cars, etc. as they sought to always be legal, and we often rented large parcels of ranchlands to construct our tent cities, all of which would have been an enormous bill. Ollody’s dad was a high court judge in connecticut and ollody was able to get monies on one or more occasions by tapping into his trust funds. Sarah (srfody) also got some funds that way years later. At first they woudl give each partnership money to go buy their groceries with and bring them back to our wyoming camp. For a few months they gave us “mad money” to spend however we wanted. This was for just under 100 people at that time. When I left Do had pursers give me $600.00 and the plane ticket to phoenix to stay with mark and sarah who volunteered to house me temporarily.When Mark and sarah were asked to leave they gave them a car and I dont know how much money. Just dumping some of the money matters I know about. Of couse I didn’t know everything about the money matters as I was never in the “purser” crew. I know there was a fund that was in the low 5 figures long after we’d moved into houses and half of us had well paying professional jobs, they tried to hold onto that in case they got instructions to go somewhere or do something that was costly or should some thing happen to the jobs. At that time we were renting 1, 2, and sometimes 3 large 6 bedroom homes in nice areas of town that were all at least 4 thou a month and some homes were around 8k a month. I remember when we were in california into the early 90’s we were broke. Do was stressed about that as we had huge expenses with around 30 mouths to feed and cars to upkeep and at that time the reason we were broke was because Do felt instruction to sell all we had before that and outfit ourselves to camp again. When that happened we had three very large homes full of nice furnishings, to include paintings, and crystal and gold leafed dinner ware as Ti and Do felt to keep everything looking modern and “normal” for when realtors or owners would come to visit and sometime nice things were harder to care for so it became a lesson to care for them. We had a fleet of about a dozen very nice cars and vans around then and sold some of the more expensive and had estate sales for the content of the homes and took the money and bought trailors and tents and such and then went to the desert near phoenix to fast to see if the Next Level would pick us up from showing we were not comfortable though we had in a way become such.

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One Response to “causual talk about the early days with Ti (Peep) and Do (Bo) in 1975”

  1. causual talk about the early days with Ti (Peep) and Do (Bo) in 1975 | ChristianBookBarn.com Says:

    […] Recommended Article FROM https://sawyerhg.wordpress.com/2013/06/14/causual-talk-about-the-early-days-with-ti-peep-and-do-bo-in… […]

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