Archive for May, 2016

Q and A – Did Ti and Do (Heaven’s Gate founders) feel emotions?

May 27, 2016

Here are some questions I was asked on this blog, followed by my reply that has mainly to do with Ti and Do’s show of emotion:

Questions:

“Hello, I know you don’t know me and I’m a random stranger but If im not mistaken you were part of the heavens gate group for a long time and I have a few questions about Do(Marshall Applewhite) and the group. Some people believe that Marshall didn’t feel any emotions, and he didn’t care about his classroom or his students. During the time you with him, did he ever show any degree of emotion? And this may be personal but when Ti(Bonnie Nettles) from cancer, was Marshall devastated, did you see him cry? Or emotionally distraught? Second, I’ve studied and researched about the heavens gate group for a good while and I’ve come to notice that Marshall seemed to dislike the world, hated it. Why? Was it because people were cruel to one another and such? And lastly, during the time you were in the group, how were the other members like? From what I’ve heard they seemed pretty nice and good honest people looking for a meaning to life. Oh and one last question, Was Doh, controlling of you guys or was he laid back type of person? Thank you for your time”

Sawyer’s response:

Yes, we all showed emotion. However, we were to control our emotions – self-control, whether anger or happiness but it’s not like it was laid out in a measured way. For instance an angry outburst would have certainly been a slippage but there was no prescribed punishment except for acknowledging our slippage before the group of other students in a “slippage meeting” (that was a little embarrassing) and including a “remedy” to have better control in the future. If we watched something on television or went to a movie and something was funny we laughed but if our laughter was bursting at the seams, rolling on the floor that probably would have been brought up at a meeting as out of control. It certainly would not be wrong for someone not trying to overcome their humanness in Ti and Do’s program to roll on the floor. After all this was voluntary and not coerced and no one was lured or manipulated (though of course there are those who would say it was manipulation to think Ti and Do were from the Kingdom of Heaven in outer space, their souls that is) but for all practical vantage points day-to-day participation was completely voluntary which shows in the amount of people who said they believed but over the years drifted off or were coaxed to leave by Do or were instructed to leave by Do or were sent to a half way house type of arrangement to get better control or sent to be with their human families again that turned into a type of lure back into the world. However, they made no bones about leaving the classroom as being a failure to complete one’s “task” to get control over one’s vehicle to graduate the human kingdom. It just wasn’t drilled into us or used as leverage to guilt us into staying. We did have to measure up to stay.

Yes, I saw Do shed tears on a number of occasions. I also saw Ti shed tears on a couple of occasions. One of those occasions was related to Ti’s exit of her vehicle. Do certainly was distraught. He certainly depended on Ti and loved her, though it was never anything physical or human – He loved her Mind. He told us he gave Ti a hard time for the first year or so as it took being together day and night traveling around the country trying to figure out what their task was exactly – what were the updates to the bible they knew their Minds were sent to bring and what were the prophecies they were sent to fulfill. Ti never told Do she was his “Older Member” (heavenly Father). He came to know it because of how Ti thought and the choices she made that summed up the options more quickly and more accurately, where Do felt he needed to try things Ti knew would not pan out to their task needs.

Crying as in sobbing was considered to be giving into that form of sensuality. Even jumping up and down at that sight of a beautiful sunset would have been giving into that form of sensuality. All pleasure was not prohibited. It simply needed to be a “pleasure” They provided, such as a nice dessert or some type of sport exercise – we had a track to run on at one of our “crafts” in south Austin and had an indoor racquetball court in another in Paradise Valley and an indoor pool in texas and others with outdoor pools, though in each there were “procedures” on how to use them and how often and became lesson opportunities on how to enjoy them “in the way a member of the Next Level would do”.

I can’t speak to exactly how Do thought about the “world” before he was awakened by and with Ti, except that he, his vehicle (that was prepared for his incarnation (taking over for his Next Level task) dropped out of seminary because they were too restrictive of what to study and consider. At another time he said when he would go to the hollywood styled parties in Houston, as he was a popular lead role opera singer in the Houston opera and a teacher of music and voice at St. Thomas University, when they would serve shrimp cocktail, the first time he had it, he went to the bathroom and threw up but then forced himself to eat it because it was expected. Just a tiny example.

He was unhappy with relationships, in the last year before awakening was turning anti-sexual, though had been in relationship with men (I don’t know how many) but that he wanted a “committed relationship” he was not finding in his high society involvements.

I know the rumors that he was so distraught over his sexuality that he allegedly checked into a mental facility as well as the rumors Ti wanted a physical relationship with him and that he went off the deep end when Ti left which then became the consideration of “suicide” which there is considerable evidence is all mis/dis-information. Do set that record straight in his booklet entitled, “’88 update – The UFO Two and Crew”. Ti never made any advances to him and he said though he wondered at first if she was trying to pick him up, he said he had no physical attraction to Ti’s vehicle and “wouldn’t dirty his mouth on Ti’s mouth” – or anyone’s mouth for that matter.

Do did kiss his students on the forehead or cheek a time or two, one time publicly in a type of marriage ceremony where students went up to him one by one and he was weepy during. He kissed me in this way on a couple of times when he was meeting with the student body individually in private that included his touching my head/face and speaking affectionately with zero touching or kissing or hugging any more than that.

Of course critics would guess he did more than that with some but there is zero evidence of that and there have been many dropouts who were drilled by media over the years before their exit and since their exit of their incarnations.

It was Ti that told the class we needed to give Them our will. And it was Ti that instructed us to make our “committal” to Do – doing so in writing though Do knew he needed to accept that position of being the focus of every students total love as Jesus said was the “first commandment” – to love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul and strength – the reason Jesus students needed to “deny self” (give their will over to their Older Member’s will for them), “take up their cross” (give their lives up in service) and “follow me” – (literally leave one’s human attachments behind to be with Jesus and abide by all his teachings during and after his exit).

There was always plenty of laughter and lightheartedness and even a time or two of outright silliness while times also of knowing that we missed the mark, got off track, disappointed them, needed to work harder on our lessons. We were certainly prodded in that way. They were not permissive of human behavior. There was no gossip or chit chatting or “familiarity” with fellow students or with Ti and Do though over the years some of what would have been called chit chat relaxed some as the student body had matured so had a sense of where to draw the lines. No chummyness. though partners were to commit themselves to helping their partners with their overcoming.

We even once had a type of marriage ceremony between assigned “partners” where we each vowed to the other our committment to help them in their overcoming of humanness and service to Ti and Do. My partner was Chkody (check-ody) a soul who had a female vehicle that actually challenged me because of my vehicle having an attraction to her vehicle (though I never permitted any kind of fantasy of being with her). However, it was difficult for me to deal with and I did tend to treat her differently because of the vehicles attraction, which was part of what I needed to overcome.

Neither Ti and Do were “laid back”, though there were certainly many times when we enjoyed a meal together or went on an outing together or watched television together. Part of our lessons were to maintain a “pleasant countenance” and not give into tiredness, maintain good posture, cleanliness, soft spoken, whispering or silent times, gentle actions whether walking or in the closing of doors – like one would imagine in a monastery without getting into a spiritual or religious dogma or holiness self grandizing, or artificial “worshipping” vibration. (That’s really very controlled as is in the many does and don’ts in society, business and politics.

We had music at times and did choral singing of christmas carols several years in a row before Ti exited. By the way, Do said Ti “burnt out her vehicle” dealing with the negativity from the many “influences” (discarnates) who attacked her especially since she was the Oldest Member incarnate. Ti and Do both took on the students influences and at times ran them off so we could have a better chance of seeing clearly.

Do did indicate he used alcohol while in the world. One time during the christmas before Ti exited we had a christmas tree and a party and we each had about a half ounce of wine in a shot glass. Do said afterwards that he didn’t like the way it affected his consciousness so would not be doing that again.

That year we were each given some money and went shopping to buy gifts for the “craft” not for one another, though some students organized the purchase of some gifts for Ti and Do. Even though it wasn’t procedure to do that, it was “taking a chance on a positive” and Ti and Do were never without consideration of the moment and the good intentions of the students as opposed to sticking to the letter of the “law”, though that could certainly have a breaking point. For instance any hint of sexuality would have been against their lessons to be permissive of.

When we were sent to visit with vehicle’s families the first time while Ti was still in her vehicle and we returned, it was approved that each student could give the returning student a hug but other than that time we generally did not hug one another and there was never any kissing between students – though on a couple of occasions a couple of students did slip and it was surfaced had been feeling one another up in a closet and in one case in 1976 in Wyoming campground two students had sex.

On one occasion when Ross Perot was running for president, Ti and Do indicated his being a businessman might be good for the country. They considered having us vote that year but we didn’t and never did in the 19 years I was with them.

It was not a solemn environment but nor was it happy-go-lucky. I would not call Ti and Do controlling at all but it was a fact that if we didn’t want to follow their teachings their classroom wasn’t the place for us. Do even offered students $2000 at one point to leave if the money would help them make that choice as he didn’t want people staying in the classroom because of how easy life became – having that infrastructure to depend upon. Ti used to call the world outside the classroom, “the real world” which always puzzled me but I grew to understand that the classroom consisted of a very “controlled environment” to where one didn’t have to worry about bills and children and social engagements and business and if one lost their job there were others with jobs to depend upon.

The control was in the design of procedures to follow which arose as needed but it was self-control yet partners were committed to pointing out to their partners when they were breaking procedure and there were other overseers with the task of providing correction to fellow students most of which was done in private and when Ti and Do corrected specific students most of the time that too was done in private or addressed in general in a meeting though there were a few exceptions.

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